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Intra Ranch Go Game!

Axel Janssen
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Joined: Jan 08, 2001
Posts: 2164
I wanna say beforehand that longer periods of thinking might not be caused by lack of interest, but more with a not small amount of respect in the skills of the opponent.
Some comments, guys
I feel that this is going to be an important move for this game.

thx
Axel
Bert Bates
author
Sheriff

Joined: Oct 14, 2002
Posts: 8801
    
    5
And I'd like to add that this is for fun, and I hope other players will join the white team!


Spot false dilemmas now, ask me how!
(If you're not on the edge, you're taking up too much room.)
Axel Janssen
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Joined: Jan 08, 2001
Posts: 2164
I think none of the black groups at the bottom can be killed by w.
and so: K12.
(most unexpected trick move).
[ February 06, 2006: Message edited by: Axel Janssen ]
Bert Bates
author
Sheriff

Joined: Oct 14, 2002
Posts: 8801
    
    5
that move (k12) seems very solid - it's a good extension from black's wall on the 16 row.

white will play c13 as a response...
Axel Janssen
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Joined: Jan 08, 2001
Posts: 2164
E13
Bert Bates
author
Sheriff

Joined: Oct 14, 2002
Posts: 8801
    
    5
b16...

i'll be off skiing for a few days so someone will have to take up the slack for the white team

(btw i thought e13 was a pretty cool move)
Axel Janssen
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Joined: Jan 08, 2001
Posts: 2164
C17.
Happy skiing.
Hope there'll be someone.
Ryan McGuire
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Joined: Feb 18, 2005
Posts: 1006
    
    3
Originally posted by Axel Janssen:
I think none of the black groups at the bottom can be killed by w...


I'm willing to harass one of them for fun and profit.

56. N2

To anyone else taking up the White cause: Play in this area only while it's sente. If Black gets a chance he'll try to make eyes with a move like S3. I figured the gap between 50 and the board edge was a bigger escape route than between 2 and the edge, so it was the first move. Also, check to see if there are enough liberties to monkey jump from N2 to Q1 to take out more eye space. If Black is willing to sacrifice 37 to save 39, I'd be willing to settle for that; it'll just make White's group stronger facing the middle of the board. (Of course, White should get as much of the corner as possible.

If Black's corner is unkillable, don't end in gote. White's next move after the sequence in the corner might be an extension along the bottom edge (K3?), or something to slow Black 47 and 49 down (S7?). And lastly B17 may be big enough to be sente.

Ryan
Axel Janssen
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Joined: Jan 08, 2001
Posts: 2164
s3
Ryan McGuire
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Joined: Feb 18, 2005
Posts: 1006
    
    3
Obviously S4
Axel Janssen
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Joined: Jan 08, 2001
Posts: 2164
p2 (should work, I think)

comment: m3 would be an elegant move. Does not work unfortunatedly.
[ February 07, 2006: Message edited by: Axel Janssen ]
Bert Bates
author
Sheriff

Joined: Oct 14, 2002
Posts: 8801
    
    5
j4 - man the snow was gooood...
Axel Janssen
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Joined: Jan 08, 2001
Posts: 2164
j3.
Bert Bates
author
Sheriff

Joined: Oct 14, 2002
Posts: 8801
    
    5
g5 - again, tryingto be consistent with the stones
Axel Janssen
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jan 08, 2001
Posts: 2164
k4.
being a bit jelous of the w framework in the left lower corner.
Bert Bates
author
Sheriff

Joined: Oct 14, 2002
Posts: 8801
    
    5
h4 - steady as she goes...
Axel Janssen
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jan 08, 2001
Posts: 2164
g3, obvious
Bert Bates
author
Sheriff

Joined: Oct 14, 2002
Posts: 8801
    
    5
g11 - if black can make extensions from his wall...
Axel Janssen
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jan 08, 2001
Posts: 2164
k5
Bert Bates
author
Sheriff

Joined: Oct 14, 2002
Posts: 8801
    
    5
j6 - maybe black is forcing white to make good shape...
Bert Bates
author
Sheriff

Joined: Oct 14, 2002
Posts: 8801
    
    5
black must be plotting a very devious plan...
Axel Janssen
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Joined: Jan 08, 2001
Posts: 2164
r7
Ryan McGuire
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Joined: Feb 18, 2005
Posts: 1006
    
    3
Originally posted by Bert Bates:
black must be plotting a very devious plan...


I've been looking at Black's possibilites. I trying to work a way for a black at E4 to let black either take stones 4 and 34 or make a double atari at H5. But I'm just not getting it yet.

There are so many opportunities for either Black or White to play "on the intersection of two moyos" that I can't tell which is best.
Around moves 10 and 51?
66 and 51?
67 and 68?
67 and 50?
45 and 46?
Can White capture 51 (and the surrounding territory)?

Plus the area around 48 and 49 is unsettled. A couple little pushes could make a big difference.

And the black group has still left the door open to White 44.

What the biggest??? (...and sente?)
Bert Bates
author
Sheriff

Joined: Oct 14, 2002
Posts: 8801
    
    5
white plays q7 - and ryan you still get to be thinking all your thoughts
Axel Janssen
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Joined: Jan 08, 2001
Posts: 2164
r9 (67 was a really stupid one).
[ February 14, 2006: Message edited by: Axel Janssen ]
Bert Bates
author
Sheriff

Joined: Oct 14, 2002
Posts: 8801
    
    5
q8 - an old go teacher once told me - don't panic, just connect...
Bert Bates
author
Sheriff

Joined: Oct 14, 2002
Posts: 8801
    
    5
Hey guys,

Last night I lost a won game because I forgot to stop and count the board! Man, this happens over and over to me

The theory is that if both players have made mostly good moves (i.e. no big mistakes), then the score should be roughly even. The thing is there is usually a tradeoff between power and profit, so if you count the board and it seems that you have more profit, then your opponent probably has more power. Further, if your opponent has more power, then you must have weaknesses somewhere. So, if you're ahead in territory, it might be a good idea to step back and strengthen your weaknesses - even if it means giving up a little profit, and on the flip-side, if you're behind in territory it might be time to consider an attack...

My personal little personality flaw seems to be I can't see the weaknesses in my own stones, so I was way ahead in territory, and sure enough my opponent found a weakness that I hadn't seen. IF I had had the discipline to stop and count the board, I might have discovered the weakness in time.

All that said, does anyone want to estimate the score on the board, maybe with a breakdown like:

white has 30 points on the left side, 10 points in the upper right... ??
Axel Janssen
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Joined: Jan 08, 2001
Posts: 2164
The fascinating points of Go is that the games somehow shows you inner weaknesses. greed, hate, arrogance, lack of focus, cowardliness.
My most ridiculous reaction: when a supposed weaker player kills one of my groups with mayor importance I use to think: What a nitpicking idiot. Lacking real sense for greater beauty, he's just killing groups. Its hilarious.
Its good to think about such reactions.
I would like to have more time for Go. Now its a time I should study more, play less. The friend I played with during age 17-20 (we were not very good, but played regularly) is dead now. He's the only dead friend I have. I re-discovered Go last year.

I guess (after some thinking)
b has 45 points in the upper left.
w has 40 points in the lower left/left (A, B, C row)
and 30 more in the center (connected with lower left/left (very thick)
b has 8 on the lower side.
b has 3 points on the right lower corner.
w has another 15 points on the right side
w has 12 points on the upper right
b has 12 points on the right side.

[ February 15, 2006: Message edited by: Axel Janssen ]

[ February 15, 2006: Message edited by: Axel Janssen ]
[ February 15, 2006: Message edited by: Axel Janssen ]
Axel Janssen
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jan 08, 2001
Posts: 2164
r6 btw.
Bert Bates
author
Sheriff

Joined: Oct 14, 2002
Posts: 8801
    
    5
white - q5...

i think your scores are pretty good, except maybe black's upper left isn't quite so big, and white's center isn't quite so big, and the area around p9 is really hard to estimate...

So that means that white is ahead in territory, so black should try to find a weakness in one or two of white's groups...
Axel Janssen
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jan 08, 2001
Posts: 2164
c11
Bert Bates
author
Sheriff

Joined: Oct 14, 2002
Posts: 8801
    
    5
Wow! That's a deep invasion! Normally it's a bad idea to make killing a group a goal, but when an invasion is this deep it is sometimes the only strategy...I tried to think of a peaceful solution to this invasion, but I couldn't come up with anything but to fight

w - d12

this is going to be exciting!
Axel Janssen
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jan 08, 2001
Posts: 2164
c10.
those white stones will find their way out of the white box.
(showing excessive confidence to confuse opponent )
Bert Bates
author
Sheriff

Joined: Oct 14, 2002
Posts: 8801
    
    5
w - d11 - just connect - it's getting nerve-wracking
Roger Johnson
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Joined: Feb 24, 2004
Posts: 311
Originally posted by Bert Bates:
w - d11 - just connect - it's getting nerve-wracking


Bert Bates
author
Sheriff

Joined: Oct 14, 2002
Posts: 8801
    
    5
white is on pins and needles...
Bert Bates
author
Sheriff

Joined: Oct 14, 2002
Posts: 8801
    
    5
white is getting very nervous!
Ryan McGuire
Ranch Hand

Joined: Feb 18, 2005
Posts: 1006
    
    3
I just can't take it anymore!

Black: o4
Bert Bates
author
Sheriff

Joined: Oct 14, 2002
Posts: 8801
    
    5
this really IS going to get complicated!

w o5
Axel Janssen
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jan 08, 2001
Posts: 2164
Sorry guys. I didn't see myself as the only player for black.
Should have posted a message.
I am on a new project and I am developing tunnel perspective in such situations.
Am going to step back to a spectator position. As a fan of Ryan.
 
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