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FYI: Mandrake 9 vs Redhat 8

Gregg Bolinger
GenRocket Founder
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Joined: Jul 11, 2001
Posts: 15289
    
    6

I have tried them both.
Mandrake is deffinatly better. They made it easier for the typical user while maintaining the functionallity of Linux for developers and pros.
Redhat made things TOO simple and a lot of functionallity was replaced with usablity.
I recommend Mandrake 9 over Redhat 8 any day.


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Adam Hardy
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Joined: Oct 09, 2001
Posts: 565
How about some concrete examples?
I'm using Redhat 8 and it's fine for me. I am a bit of a newby though. I find KDE ok too. The biggest gripe on my list at the moment is the daunting feeling I get when I think about having to recompile my kernel to get various things like video drivers, sound card drivers, mobo chip monitor etc working.
I like rpms, SysV start-up, and other stuff like that.


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Frank Carver
Sheriff

Joined: Jan 07, 1999
Posts: 6920
Can you also tell us a bit more about the kind of things you are using your Linux installation for?
I haven't particularly liked Mandrake or RedHat the times I have tried them, as they both assumed I wanted to install a GUI, and some important tools either didn't work or acted in a very strange way when I chose not to install/use a GUI.


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Greg Harris
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Joined: Apr 12, 2001
Posts: 1012
i haven't tried any distros other than redhat, but i can give a fairly good run down on the pros and cons of redhat 8.0 vs. 7.x.
i primarily use my machine for programming (i am in school for computer science and mathematics) and learing about linux in general.
8.0 is very easy to install and has a nice gui (bluecurve is redhat's hybrid kde/gnome gui).
redhat also has a "server class" installation that assumes you ARE NOT using a gui, so by default, the gui is not installed. however, it installs the most common server packages and your machine is optimized for performance (not point-and-click).
the usb support is a lot better than the previous 7.x distros, but that is because of the new kernel.
8.0 uses iptables by default where 7.x uses ipchains for networking. i understand that iptables are better (more secure?) than chains - but i am familiar with chains, so i did not like 8.0 forcing me to use tables.
i did a fresh install of 8.0 on my machine a few weeks ago and found that a bunch of the networking stuff either did not work properly, or was not the same as what i am used to - so i reinstalled 7.2 and then upgraded to 8.0 and picked only the packages that i wanted.
i have my win98 (i unfortunately need M$ for school) laptop networked with my 7.2/8.0 machine at home so i can share my printer and internet connection. 8.0 seems to make the network setup more difficult than the 7.x distros, so that is a big reason for my reverting back.
and, of course, there is the mp3 issue with 8.0. yes, you can download a package that takes care of the problem with XMMS mp3 support, but Noatun's player does not have one yet (i like noatun better than xmms). does this mean that redhat is getting to be too "main-stream?"
i would like to try mandrake, but i have always had the impression that it was the "user-friendly" version for newbies... of course, i am a newbie, but i like to do things the hard way.
a friend of mine at school suggested that i try "gentoo" linux... he says the install is detailed because the entire OS is compiled when you install it (so it takes a very long time), but it is configured specifically to your machine - so after the install, the operating system is extremely fast. anyone else try gentoo?


what?
Bhupinder Dhillon
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Joined: Oct 12, 2000
Posts: 124
I like Mandrake 9.0 primarily for it's ease of use and more intuitive messages/labels on GUIs which makes it easy to use without having to lookup the documentation.
The only thing missing is VPN connection using SecurID. Does anyone know if there's a freely available client for this or if there's a way to manually create a connection script for it? I've read the documents on creating the VPN using SSH but somehow I don't think it will work with SecurID feature. The one that my company distributes is Nortel Contivity Client for windows. Nortel also has a client for linux/unix but I don't want to buy it.
Any alternatives are appreciated.
Gregg Bolinger
GenRocket Founder
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Joined: Jul 11, 2001
Posts: 15289
    
    6

Sorry about the delay in response guys. I am compiling a good response thought.
Here is a link to a free VPN for linux.
Bhupinder Dhillon
Ranch Hand

Joined: Oct 12, 2000
Posts: 124
Thanks for the quick reply, however, I have already checked it out and it doesn't support authentication using SecurID http://www.freeswan.org/freeswan_snaps/CURRENT-SNAP/doc/faq.html#Radius
Any other suggestions short of re-installing windows for it.
George Brown
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Joined: Sep 26, 2000
Posts: 919
I have to admit that although Mandrake has a lovely easy installation and auto-configuration phase you really don't need to install GUIs and even if you do it is a trivial change to the inittab to boot into a different runlevel, dispensing with the GUIs.
I've been using a Mandrake 9.0 installation as a web server/firewall/gateway without any GUI since it was released for download on their website and I'm quite happy with it so far. Although I can see why Mandrake is seen as a good distribution for linux newcomers because of the ease of installation/configuration and inclusion of KDE/GNOME, it should be pointed out that if you prefer it can be as barebones as you want it to be.
Thomas White
Ranch Hand

Joined: Feb 01, 2003
Posts: 32
Greg Harris,
I haven't tried Gentoo myself, but know several people who are running it and I've heard the same things you mentioned.
Tom
Allan Peak
Greenhorn

Joined: Jul 10, 2002
Posts: 7
I haven't tried Mandrake 9, but I wasn't too thrilled with earlier versions. RH8 seemed to work better, but I'm still not happy with it. I'm currently trying Libranet, which is based on Debian, but much easier to install.
Greg Harris
Ranch Hand

Joined: Apr 12, 2001
Posts: 1012
i am about to give SuSE 8.1 a try, so i will post a comparision in a couple weeks. however, this one is not free unless you do the FTP install.
i did download the gentoo distro, but it takes too long to install and i just do not have the time or patience to deal with it right now... maybe this summer.
Sudharsan Govindarajan
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jul 03, 2002
Posts: 319
Originally posted by Adam Hardy:
How about some concrete examples?

Mandrake has support for a larger base of Hardware (even very low-end display drivers, Sound cards) than RH.
Mandrake support for many languages. This is a thriving factor in Asian countries. Atleast I'm happy to see it in my native language
RH8 drifts away from the standard GUI environments KDE and GNOME. Too bad! If it wants to simplify the UI why can't it contribute more to the development of KDE or GNOME.
Gregg Bolinger
GenRocket Founder
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Joined: Jul 11, 2001
Posts: 15289
    
    6

Originally posted by Sudharsan G'rajan:

RH8 drifts away from the standard GUI environments KDE and GNOME. Too bad! If it wants to simplify the UI why can't it contribute more to the development of KDE or GNOME.

I am a Mandrake fan as well. However, in Redhats defense, all they did was create s skinned Universal Look and Feel for GNOME AND KDE. It is still GNOME and it is still KDE.
Dominik Tschirky
Greenhorn

Joined: Feb 05, 2003
Posts: 2
I have a question:
Can you install Red Hat 8.0 and Mandrake 9.0 on a 2 GByte Harddisk?
Gregg Bolinger
GenRocket Founder
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jul 11, 2001
Posts: 15289
    
    6

Yes you can. You can even install both on the same 2 GB hard drive. On my development Linux Box, I only had to install about 1 Gig. On my Servers (apache, mysql, ect) I usually hit somewhere around 500 MB. Sometimes less, depending on the extra libraries I need when I have to compile things on them.
Dominikk Tschirky
Greenhorn

Joined: Feb 06, 2003
Posts: 4
How do I install Mandrake 9.0 next to Red Hat 8.0? What order must I use?
I don't hope I need to use something with the shell. Because I do not know anything at all about it.
mfg
Dominikk Tschirky
stephen Kang
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jul 26, 2002
Posts: 53
i have used Mandrake, Redhat, Debian (and progeny), Slackware, freebsd, openbsd and Solaris 8, no suse yet on desktop and laptop.
I am currently running redhat 8.0.
If you are targeting for the market, i would think redhat is good choice.
Since ibm products(websphere stuffs and domino stuffs) working seamless and oracle db(oracle 8i/9i) tend to support redhat first.
But cons of using redhat is u have to bear microsoft-like-linux. it means proprietary and you should depend on redhat rpm and their sysv4 style configuration. Mandrake is a bit open source aware version of redhat. so mileages are similiar.
if you are rigourous about GNU original, you really want to get debian. GNU linux is actually debian linux, thus you can follow up and hack the source code and compile without mysterious errors. when you need to recompile the kernel or some ide(gnome/kde/windowmaker), gnu linux doesn require headache since you just need to follow the README file for the package.
Slackware is really good choice,too for who wants to know hacking the linux codes.
If you want to get really stable version BSD and willing to some business with that, FreeBSD Unix isn't bad choice, too. Every linux materials from GNU is children of BSD. But i am not sure what the market of bsd look like right now.
Keep in mind, Mac OS X can run with FreeBSD. If you still like to use mac os x, u r using mac os x top of freebsd kernel.
Though sun server market is struggling because teh strength of linux, Solaris 8/9 has some advantage for solaris guys. you can download solaris 8/9 x86 version from Sun with small fees. Be aware that installation of x86 solaris is not that simple because they don't support lots of drivers for x86. i don't know what the sun is thinking about x86 solaris if they don't support rigourously.
OpenBSD is security enhanced version of bsd OS.
i 've heard the gov't likes to use OpenBSD.
The installation of OpenBSD is not that simple,either.
There is NetBSD, which i haven't had an experience about that. NetBSD is supporting more hardware drivers than those two bsds.
[ February 21, 2003: Message edited by: stephen Kang ]

Stephen Kang
 
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