GeeCON Prague 2014*
The moose likes Linux / UNIX and the fly likes Bored of Gentoo - What next? Big Moose Saloon
  Search | Java FAQ | Recent Topics | Flagged Topics | Hot Topics | Zero Replies
Register / Login


JavaRanch » Java Forums » Engineering » Linux / UNIX
Bookmark "Bored of Gentoo - What next?" Watch "Bored of Gentoo - What next?" New topic
Author

Bored of Gentoo - What next?

Joe Ess
Bartender

Joined: Oct 29, 2001
Posts: 8914
    
    8

I've been using Gentoo for years now. It�s got some things going for it. I like portage and the community but it is WAY high maintenance. It�s time to admit it. I don�t have time to fiddle with the kernel and tweak various config files anymore. Not to mention recent updates have caused some non-trivial breakage, like X and K3B.
I need a desktop distro, not a hobbyist distro. I�ve been using SUSE 10 and Ubuntu at work, but that�s mostly using SSH to control servers. At home, the Linux box is the 100% uptime box: web surfing, running my web server (tomcat), creating and burning DVDs, desktop publishing and so on.
Ubuntu seems to be the desktop distro of choice now. It seems groggy here, but that may be because I�m running it inside vmware. My home computer is no speed demon (1.4Ghz, 768Mb RAM). I figure I�d use the bootable CD for a few days to try it out so I can just boot back to Gentoo if things don�t work out. Anybody else using it? Doing casual Java development on it?


"blabbing like a narcissistic fool with a superiority complex" ~ N.A.
[How To Ask Questions On JavaRanch]
Gregg Bolinger
GenRocket Founder
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jul 11, 2001
Posts: 15299
    
    6

I use Xubuntu at home and at work. It's Ubuntu but with Xfce for the desktop instead of Gnome. It seems quite a bit snappier to me than Gnome or KDE.


GenRocket - Experts at Building Test Data
Joe Ess
Bartender

Joined: Oct 29, 2001
Posts: 8914
    
    8

I use Xfce on my SUSE 10 desktop and I agree, it feels faster than KDE in Gentoo or Gnome in Ubuntu.
I'd be inclined to use Kubuntu since the wife's already used to the KDE interface. Do you have any reservations about straying from the default 'flavor', or is it just a matter of enabling the other windows manager in the distro?
I guess I could read the FAQ and answer my own question. . .
[ November 02, 2006: Message edited by: Joe Ess ]
Gregg Bolinger
GenRocket Founder
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jul 11, 2001
Posts: 15299
    
    6

Technically, you can install Ubuntu and then install all the desktop managers you want. But if you are only using one, then why? I suppose you could install Kubuntu and then add Xfce so that your wife can enjoy KDE and you can use Xfce.
Tim Holloway
Saloon Keeper

Joined: Jun 25, 2001
Posts: 16093
    
  21

You'd probably be better off with Fedora, if your main gripe is spending too much time tweaking everything. Just install vanilla binaries except for the items you really want tweaked.

If you just would prefer not to update the OS at all every 6 months or so, something like CentOS would be good.


Customer surveys are for companies who didn't pay proper attention to begin with.
Joe Ess
Bartender

Joined: Oct 29, 2001
Posts: 8914
    
    8

Greg: That would probably blow my wife's mind, should she see Xfce when I'm logged in, then see KDE the next time she logged in. She's still trying to wrap her head around having a home directory and no c: drive.

Tim: I ran RedHat Linux 7-8-9 and moved to Gentoo when they created Fedora. I guess I didn't like the idea of testing/bugfixing for RHEL (whether that's true or not). Fedora is still more bleeding edge than Ubuntu or Suse, which aim for stability.
Never looked at CentOS.
Lewin Chan
Ranch Hand

Joined: Oct 10, 2001
Posts: 214
CentOS have a 4.4 live CD I believe now, so you can try it out like the others

I use CentOS for my home server, runs fine on a standard P4 1.8Ghz, 1Gb RAM - This does much the same thing as yours does. Obviously it's RedHat in structure, if you're familiar with RH7/8/9 you'll be fine. It doesn't suffer from the relentless upgrade cycle of Fedora. Runs perfectly well on a few DL380's (DualP3) I have in my hosting centre too.

I thought Ubuntu sucked for java development. This is, no doubt, just a personal issue, I never spent that much time looking at it, but when apt-get remove lib-gcj/gcc-java wants to remove the entire desktop environment, I think that's a bad thing, and I'm not going to jump through additional hoops trying to get things setup *just so* I can do run javac and ant. There was a forum posting I looked at to fix that problem, I looked at it, and decided I couldn't be bothered, and thus ended my quick dip in the Ubuntu pool.


I have no java certifications. This makes me a bad programmer. Ignore my post.
Joe Ess
Bartender

Joined: Oct 29, 2001
Posts: 8914
    
    8

Originally posted by Lewin Chan:

I thought Ubuntu sucked for java development.


I had a small issue with the JDK 1.5.0 install. The GUI pacakge manager didn't communicate the command-line package's license agreement dialog so it hung up. Killed the installer, ran apt-get from the command line and everything worked. I didn't try to remove the Gnu Java, so no issues there.
The thing that bugs me the most about Ubuntu is no root account. Gentoo is very root-centric for administration purposes.
Ernest Friedman-Hill
author and iconoclast
Marshal

Joined: Jul 08, 2003
Posts: 24187
    
  34

Something to consider:

I haven't had a Windows machine in years; I've been a big Linux proponent all that time. I'm still using it now as my primary desktop. But I find myself using my G4 PowerBook more and more, and am starting to very seriously consider the possibility that when this Linux desktop needs replacing -- which is probably sooner rather than later, at this point -- my next primary machine is going to be a Mac. Max OS X is, as far as user experience goes, everything you've always wanted in a Linux distribution.


[Jess in Action][AskingGoodQuestions]
Joe Ess
Bartender

Joined: Oct 29, 2001
Posts: 8914
    
    8

Originally posted by Ernest Friedman-Hill:
Max OS X is, as far as user experience goes, everything you've always wanted in a Linux distribution.


That may be, and I've been watching some of the discussions in the OSX forum with an eye on getting my wife a laptop some day, but for now, OSX requires a hardware investment and Linux will run on the computer I have now, so Linux wins.
Gregg Bolinger
GenRocket Founder
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jul 11, 2001
Posts: 15299
    
    6

Originally posted by Joe Ess:


That may be, and I've been watching some of the discussions in the OSX forum with an eye on getting my wife a laptop some day, but for now, OSX requires a hardware investment and Linux will run on the computer I have now, so Linux wins.


Amen brother.
raminaa niilian
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jul 14, 2005
Posts: 551
I suggest you try Mandriva 2007 :-)
I am new to linux and i think mandriva is good option but i do not know whether an expert will like mandriva or not.
Avinash Rawana
Ranch Hand

Joined: Feb 22, 2006
Posts: 31
I don't understand what part of Gentoo is high maintanence. I've been using Gentoo for awhile now and it's not high maintanence. Do you mean updating and waiting hours for compilation just to update? That could get annoying I guess.

Ubuntu has become such a great distro for so many people who would never have switched if it wasn't for Ubuntu. All my friends who use Windows have switched to it and love it. It has all of the support(drivers) you want for hardware.

For a desktop linux distro, I'd give it way more push than Fedora. Fedora has been a test bed that has turned sour. The bugs have killed so many people who used to like RedHat. My recently installed FC6 on a friend's machine and haven't seen any bugs..yet.



-Avinash


--------------<br />Avinash A. Ramana<br />NYIT Student<br /><a href="http://www.aramana.org" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.aramana.org</a><br />avinash@styleempire.com
Joe Ess
Bartender

Joined: Oct 29, 2001
Posts: 8914
    
    8

Originally posted by Avinash Rawana:
I don't understand what part of Gentoo is high maintanence.


In my first post I hint at some of the problems I had. Updates would break non-trivial things, like X. Every new piece of functionality (USB drives, printer, sound) would require a kernel recompile (or several!). I never knew if an error was the program's fault, my configuration, my kernel and so on. Digging into the forums and Wiki was a full-time job.
I've been using Kubuntu for a few days and it's slick. Usb, printer, sound and so on work out of the box. Installing software using apt-get (command line) or Adept (gui) is easy. In a couple of hours I had a working system that would have taken days of tinkering with Gentoo.
Raminna, as for Mandriva, I don't have time to try it, but it does have a good reputation.
The only performance problem I've had so far is the default JVM, gcj, is just plain slow. I installed Sun's JDK and all of a sudden my java apps fly.
Avinash Rawana
Ranch Hand

Joined: Feb 22, 2006
Posts: 31
If those were your problems, then you're absolutely right, Gentoo wasn't for you. I'm running it on my workstations which need every optimization and customization to even be run correctly (certain versions of X with nvidia drivers ..with certain GCC install etc).

If out of the box configuation is what you seek, Ubuntu is the best choice

I use Ubuntu on my family computer. Everything .."just works".

-Avinash
Sanjaya Sugiarto
Ranch Hand

Joined: Mar 25, 2004
Posts: 229
Like it or not, till today, the best desktop OS and user friendliest OS are Mac OSX and Windows (Oh yeah, Vista is a resources hog and a "copycat" of OSX but it is indeed a big leap in windows world and no...technically it is totally different to OSX (speak about .NET3.0, DX 10, etc)...and yes upcomming OSX Leopard will "copy" the Vista theme all-black Aero-like...now say who copies who ) ). Anyway, I dont wat to start a religious war or trolls )

For Linux, in my opinion just Novell Linux Desktop 10 is acceptable for end-users. If you want the opensource one than you should look at the SUSE 10.x.

Speaking about Linux and about Hobby OS. You should look at SkyOS ( http://www.skyos.org ) and you will think Linux is developed too slow and get bloated. (--> dont get me wrong...I dont want start a troll and I do use Linux from day-to-day basis ) )


<a href="http://www.wi.hs-furtwangen.de" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">Business Information Technology - Hochschule Furtwangen University, Germany</a>
Stefan Wagner
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jun 02, 2003
Posts: 1923

Originally posted by Sanjaya Sugiarto:
Like it or not, till today, the best desktop OS and user friendliest OS are Mac OSX and Windows.


Based on which criteria?
I didn't use Mac OS for the last 10 years, but today I performed a task on linux, while my partner did the same thing on windows:
Open eclipse, modify project properties, build path (a dialog opens), packages, add external jars: a second dialog opens.
The first dialog is hiding parts of the eclipse-window, which would be nice to read for comparision now, but the first dialog is not moveable.
On linux it is.

One of many points, where linux is superior.
Shall we talk about the registry?
Virtual desktops?


http://home.arcor.de/hirnstrom/bewerbung
 
GeeCON Prague 2014
 
subject: Bored of Gentoo - What next?