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Intel iMac and new laptop line announced at MacWorld

Bear Bibeault
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Sweet! If the performance numbers are even close to what's being claimed, these machines are going to scream.

As of this posting, the Apple site has yet to be updated. Information is available at macrumors.com if you can get in (the site is understandably getting hit hard).
[ January 10, 2006: Message edited by: Bear Bibeault ]

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Bear Bibeault
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Apple site has been updated.

New laptop line is called MacBook Pro.

Ernest Friedman-Hill
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4 times faster? !!!


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Bear Bibeault
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A seemingly incredible boast. If anywhere near true, that's going to be one hell of a development machine!

Carumba!
Jim Yingst
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Dang. Less than six months since I bought mine, and already I have Mac envy again. Well, maybe I'll wait and let others beta test the new systems for me. See if they can get these things to run Windows games, that sort of thing.


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Ernest Friedman-Hill
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Originally posted by Jim Yingst:
Less than six months since I bought mine, and already I have Mac envy again.


You and me both
marc weber
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Originally posted by Jim Yingst:
Dang. Less than six months since I bought mine, and already I have Mac envy again. Well, maybe I'll wait and let others beta test the new systems for me...

I bought two within the last 9 months: A PowerBook and an iMac.

In buying the iMac, my plan was to get a proven G5 that will allow me to ride out the Intel transition period. But now that I see these, I expect I'll be upgrading my PowerBook sooner than I expected.

I sense a revolution in the air...


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Pauline McNamara
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Originally posted by Jim Yingst:
Dang. Less than six months since I bought mine, and already I have Mac envy again.


Exactly where Steve (the Mac dealer) wants you and me (the Mac junkie) to be.

I've been holding out for a looooong time, faithfully adding RAM and a new HD to my Tibook G4 (yes, the original 400 MHz!). My old Tibook still does the trick for me. But that MacBook Pro is bringing on those shakes again.

And when a Mac junkie gets the shakes, that means she shakes some money out of her wallet...
Bear Bibeault
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Yes, the tribulations of a Mac user are ponderous!

On the one hand, Macs stay viable for so long that there's seldom a need to upgrade.

On the other hand, when they come out with new stuff, you want to have it so badly!

It's a good problem to have!
Bert Bates
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I've been holding out for a looooong time, faithfully adding RAM and a new HD to my Tibook G4 (yes, the original 400 MHz!). My old Tibook still does the trick for me. But that MacBook Pro is bringing on those shakes again.


Pauline, with a few minor changes (like mine's a 667 Mhz, and in addition to doing what you've done I also had to add a firewire card because I screwed up the built in one ), my story is the same as yours...but I'm going to jump in and get one of these bad boys when they come out in February. Also, if anyone wants to do multi-media, you can upgrade the 5400 drive for a 7200 drive for $100 - which seems like a no-brainer.

Ya-Hooooooo!

Oh, BTW, I actually got to drive one for a few minutes-even the apps that aren't "ported" yet, and are running thru the Rosetta layer, are still... smokin' !


Oops, one more thing - it's about 1/2 an inch wider, and those extra pixels are crisp and bright!

[ January 12, 2006: Message edited by: Bert Bates ]
[ January 12, 2006: Message edited by: Bert Bates ]

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Bear Bibeault
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Originally posted by Bert Bates:

Oh, BTW, I actually got to drive one for a few minutes


Green. I'm green with envy.

Originally posted by Bert Bates:

even the apps that aren't "ported" yet, and are running thru the Rosetta layer, are still... smokin' !


That's one thing I was very interested in. I'm a lot less conerned with my current hardware becoming "obsolete" than with my considerable investment in software becoming so. It's great to hear that if/when I do get a new machine, my PPC-compiled software will still be viable.
Pauline McNamara
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Originally posted by Bear Bibeault:

[...] if/when I do get a new machine


If? Ya right.
[ January 13, 2006: Message edited by: Pauline McNamara ]
Pauline McNamara
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Cool Bert! You'll have to keep us posted after you get yours. (I'm going to wait a few months for you to discover any little problems and for them to issue the new and improved way wicked bad boys, he he. )


you can upgrade the 5400 drive for a 7200 drive for $100

This is good to know too, but why they don't just offer it from the start is a mystery to me.


Can't wait to see one up close...
Jim Yingst
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[Bert]: Oops, one more thing - it's about 1/2 an inch wider, and those extra pixels are crisp and bright!

Assuming you're comparing to the 15" PowerBook, according to the specs the new machine actually has fewer pixels. The old PowerBook has a native/max resolution of 1440 x 960, while the new MacBook is 1440 x 900. The aspect ratio has gone from 1.5 to 1.6, an "increase" achieved entirely by removing 6.25% of the pixels vertically. Not a problem really in my opinion, but anyone expecting more pixels might be disappointed. The apple site does also make a point of talking about the improved brightness which Bert alludes to. As for dimensions, they've gone from 13.7 x 9.5 x 1.1 to 14.1 x 9.6 x 1.0 (inches). Weight is apparently the same at 5.6 lb.
Chengwei Lee
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Would all applications on Intel work on the new Mac? Could I also migrate my existing hardware to it, such as CDRW, DVDRW, modem, mouse & keyboard?

It certainly would booast my morale having a Mac on my desktop!


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Bear Bibeault
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The good news:

Originally posted by Chengwei Lee:
Could I also migrate my existing hardware to it, such as CDRW, DVDRW, modem, mouse & keyboard?


For the most part, such hardware is usually Mac-compatible. There are exceptions, but usually things like that just work.

Now the bad news:

Originally posted by Chengwei Lee:
Would all applications on Intel work on the new Mac?


No. Software is much more than the processer it is compiled to. Software written for Windows needs the Windows run-time environment in order to operate. Same for Mac-targetted software; it needs the Cocoa (or Carbon) environment in order to run. This is why you can't just take Windows programs and run them under Linux on a PC box.

You can run windows programs on a Mac using Virtual PC (software that emulates the hardware environment), and it has been speculated that VPC will be able to be a lot more performant on an Intel architecture than on the PPC.
marc weber
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Won't the Intel chips make it much easier (i.e., cost efficient) for software makers to engineer Mac versions of their product?
Bear Bibeault
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Originally posted by marc weber:
Won't the Intel chips make it much easier (i.e., cost efficient) for software makers to engineer Mac versions of their product?


I don't think so. No one writes GUI programs at the assembler level. Rather they write to the Windows/Cocoa/X-Windows APIs. Or, they write Java AWT/Swing.

The underlying processor is pretty much immaterial for these types of programs.
marc weber
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Originally posted by Bear Bibeault:
... No one writes GUI programs at the assembler level. Rather they write to the Windows/Cocoa/X-Windows APIs. Or, they write Java AWT/Swing.

The underlying processor is pretty much immaterial for these types of programs.

That makes sense. Thanks!
Chengwei Lee
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I just called my local Apple shop and was told that for the iMac PC, its hardware is fully integrated into the LCD. So I won't be able to reuse any of my existing hardware at all. And it seems that even if I wish to wish wireless keyboard & mouse, I'd have to use Mac's.

So I suppose I can pass up on the iMac.
Bear Bibeault
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Originally posted by Chengwei Lee:
for the iMac PC, its hardware is fully integrated into the LCD.


Well, yeah. That's the whole point of the iMac line. If you don't want an integrates monitor, look at the other lines other than the iMac.

Sounds like you want something more along the lines of a Mac Mini or a PowerMac. These models are currently available with the PPC processor and should be switched over to Intel during this year.

With regard to wireless devices, I have none but I have friends that use devices other than Apple's.
Bert Bates
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Well Pauline might be on the right track to wait...dang! I was just talking to a guy who seems pretty "in the know" as fas as Intel goes. He said that Intel is scheduled to announce a compatible processor ( with even lower power consumption) that runs about twice as fast as these brand new ones. And to really make it tough, these processors should be available in about 6 months!

So now what - take my 10x faster now, or wait maybe 6 months to get 20x faster...arghhh!
Bear Bibeault
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Doncha hate having to make decisions like that?!

Seriously, I'm hangin on to my PPC machines for a while as I know that they run all the software I've got. It's not the machines I'm worried about become obsolete, but my programs!

So I probably won't trade in until I'm sure that Rosetta will handle the software I own, and that the processors have the horsepower to run them at decent speed, emulation or not. I've got a lot more invested in software than I do in hardware.
Bear Bibeault
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P.S. Although with the purchase of iLife '06 and iWork ''06 I already own some universal binaries. Makes me feel like a man of the world!
[ January 26, 2006: Message edited by: Bear Bibeault ]
Chengwei Lee
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Originally posted by Bear Bibeault:
Well, yeah. That's the whole point of the iMac line. If you don't want an integrates monitor, look at the other lines other than the iMac.

Sounds like you want something more along the lines of a Mac Mini or a PowerMac. These models are currently available with the PPC processor and should be switched over to Intel during this year.


Not sure if I can play the waiting game. My computer is giving me problems lately again, probably signalling me to upgrade.
Bear Bibeault
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Originally posted by Chengwei Lee:

Not sure if I can play the waiting game.


Then I'd recommend a PPC PowerMac or Mac Mini (whichever suits your purpose better). As I've posted here and elsewhere, I don't buy the "but they'll be obsolete" line just because newer machines are coming out. Newer machines are always coming out. Just because the newer machines will have a different processor makes no difference. A PPC you buy today will be a viable platform for years to come. Current PPC software will run just fine for years, and any new universal binaries (those targeted at both platforms) will also run without a hitch.

Or, get a MacBook Pro and hook it up to an external monitor as your desktop, and also have the ability to take it portable.


My computer is giving me problems lately again, probably signalling me to upgrade.


Best reason I can think of to jump to a Mac now.
[ January 30, 2006: Message edited by: Bear Bibeault ]
Bert Bates
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I'm with Bear on this one. I run my old, old Powerbook as a desktop using a cinema display, and of course standalone when I'm on the road. Plus, with the new MacBook, you can drive even the huge, gravel-hauling 30" display

BTW, does anyone know the details of the "express slot" I think they call it, that is part of the new MacBook? I'm guessing it's not as big as a standard PCMCIA slot?
Chengwei Lee
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Originally posted by Bear Bibeault:
Best reason I can think of to jump to a Mac now.


Had embarked on the DIY journey once again. Though given the circumstances now, would have opted for the easy way out of buying the iMac, if I could start over again.
Pauline McNamara
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According to a couple email ads, the Powerbook Pro should be available now, even over on this side of the pond. Soooo, anyone ordered one yet?
Bert Bates
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We have a MacBook pro on order - it's supposed to ship in a few weeks - we've heard rumors that in about 4-5 months Apple will announce an even faster one, so we're compromising by getting just one for now
Pauline McNamara
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Sweet! Pics in a few weeks? Hmmm, 4 to 5 months, can I stand to wait that long...
Vicki Amin
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Since OS X is based on Unix, can we use an application written for Unix ... say something like BEA Weblogic on OS X ?


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Bear Bibeault
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Usually, yes. Unless the program was wirtten with system dependencies, of course. Tomcat, for example runs without a hitch. I'm not sure about weblogic, you'd need to check with BEA.
[ March 03, 2006: Message edited by: Bear Bibeault ]
Vicki Amin
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What about Eclipse? Can we run Eclipse for Linux on OS X?

And about the plugins that are available for Eclipse for Linux? Could we possibly use those with Eclipse on OS X?
Bear Bibeault
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Why would you want to run Eclipse for Linux rather than Eclipse for Mac OS X?
Vicki Amin
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Hmm, guess you are right I must have had a turkey on my head when I posted that question !!

Anyway, the point I was getting at is ... can I use the plugins available for Eclipse for Linux on the OS X?
Bear Bibeault
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I would assume so, but the eclipse site would probably be the best place to check.
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Actually, there is a problem with some Eclipse plugins under MacOS. Specifically, SWT and AWT do not get along as well on the Mac as they do under Windows / Linux. They don't cooperatively share the graphic events thread, and MacOS requires that the event thread be thread 0 (or 1, I forget).

The result is that if you have Eclipse plugins which use AWT in non-headless mode (ie, they actually do use a Graphics context for something), they will not work (won't draw). This is because Eclipse is implemented in SWT.

Any other Java apps which mix SWT and AWT on the Mac also have this problem.

And, just to keep the thread on track, my new MacBook Pro is _spiffy_!

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subject: Intel iMac and new laptop line announced at MacWorld