A good question is never answered. It is not a bolt to be tightened into place but a seed to be planted and to bear more seed toward the hope of greening the landscape of the idea. John Ciardi
The soul is dyed the color of its thoughts. Think only on those things that are in line with your principles and can bear the light of day. The content of your character is your choice. Day by day, what you do is who you become. Your integrity is your destiny - it is the light that guides your way. - Heraclitus
A good question is never answered. It is not a bolt to be tightened into place but a seed to be planted and to bear more seed toward the hope of greening the landscape of the idea. John Ciardi
The soul is dyed the color of its thoughts. Think only on those things that are in line with your principles and can bear the light of day. The content of your character is your choice. Day by day, what you do is who you become. Your integrity is your destiny - it is the light that guides your way. - Heraclitus
Gabriel
Software Surgeon
Originally posted by Gabriel Claramunt:
My only comment is almost all the modern development process are iterative, not only the agile ones, and I expect similar results from any iterative process agile or not...
"Discovering the requirements during construction, or worse, when your client starts using the product, is so expensive and so inefficient, that we will assume that no right-thinking person would do it and will not mention it again"
almost all the modern development process are iterative
A good question is never answered. It is not a bolt to be tightened into place but a seed to be planted and to bear more seed toward the hope of greening the landscape of the idea. John Ciardi
I agree in principle. Unfortunately, I've also seen many implementations of such development processes where the iteration is only in the development phase. All the requirements are still gathered up-front into some huge requirements document before any development begins, pushing all the development into the more expensive part of the cost curve.
Gabriel
Software Surgeon
Originally posted by Gabriel Claramunt:
My only comment is almost all the modern development process are iterative, not only the agile ones, and I expect similar results from any iterative process agile or not...
The soul is dyed the color of its thoughts. Think only on those things that are in line with your principles and can bear the light of day. The content of your character is your choice. Day by day, what you do is who you become. Your integrity is your destiny - it is the light that guides your way. - Heraclitus
Originally posted by Gabriel Claramunt:
And the quote is not that bad , consider a XP project: the requirements discovery is delegated to the onsite customer, what happens when you have the team ready to pair-program the tests required to start coding, but you don't have user story cards because the customer is trying to discover what it needs to be constructed? For me is expensive having a full team just waiting.
Originally posted by Gabriel Claramunt:
consider a XP project: the requirements discovery is delegated to the onsite customer, what happens when you have the team ready to pair-program the tests required to start coding, but you don't have user story cards because the customer is trying to discover what it needs to be constructed? For me is expensive having a full team just waiting. And agile or not, don't you think is expensive to develop a beautiful product that nobody needs?
(BTW, is not far from what happened to the original XP project, the CCC)
The soul is dyed the color of its thoughts. Think only on those things that are in line with your principles and can bear the light of day. The content of your character is your choice. Day by day, what you do is who you become. Your integrity is your destiny - it is the light that guides your way. - Heraclitus
Originally posted by Ilja Preuss:
As far as I can tell, the reasons for the C3 project being cancelled were rather complex. And the C3 team certainly did not work without the customer providing stories, and the system actually was in production for a couple of years.
Gabriel
Software Surgeon
Originally posted by Gabriel Claramunt:
I know the reasons are complex, I didn't mean that in C3 the team worked without stories, the comment was more about the second part: maybe it was developed with an excellent process, but AFAIK it didn't replaced the system it was intended to replace... that's why I said "a beautiful product that nobody uses" is not far from what happened to C3
The soul is dyed the color of its thoughts. Think only on those things that are in line with your principles and can bear the light of day. The content of your character is your choice. Day by day, what you do is who you become. Your integrity is your destiny - it is the light that guides your way. - Heraclitus
Gabriel
Software Surgeon
Some process, with higher focus on requirements ...
A good question is never answered. It is not a bolt to be tightened into place but a seed to be planted and to bear more seed toward the hope of greening the landscape of the idea. John Ciardi
A good question is never answered. It is not a bolt to be tightened into place but a seed to be planted and to bear more seed toward the hope of greening the landscape of the idea. John Ciardi
Gabriel
Software Surgeon
Originally posted by Gabriel Claramunt:
Some process, with higher focus on requirements have an explicit goal of align all stakeholders to avoid (or minimize) situations like "a misalignment between the goals of the Goal Doner and the Gold Owner", because they're costly for the organization and fatal for the project.
AFAIK requirements is not just writing down what the user wants (that is a good source of big failures).
The soul is dyed the color of its thoughts. Think only on those things that are in line with your principles and can bear the light of day. The content of your character is your choice. Day by day, what you do is who you become. Your integrity is your destiny - it is the light that guides your way. - Heraclitus
XP has that goal, too. And it works to achieve it by close collaboration with all stakeholders, and early feedback by frequent delivery of the actual product. If you know of a better way to achieve it, I'd seriously like to hear about it.
A good question is never answered. It is not a bolt to be tightened into place but a seed to be planted and to bear more seed toward the hope of greening the landscape of the idea. John Ciardi
Originally posted by Stan James:
I'd say management of that kind of thing is outside XP scope.
The soul is dyed the color of its thoughts. Think only on those things that are in line with your principles and can bear the light of day. The content of your character is your choice. Day by day, what you do is who you become. Your integrity is your destiny - it is the light that guides your way. - Heraclitus
A good question is never answered. It is not a bolt to be tightened into place but a seed to be planted and to bear more seed toward the hope of greening the landscape of the idea. John Ciardi