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Taking SCEA 5 exam for those already SCEA (old) certified

sam holmes
Greenhorn

Joined: Sep 07, 2007
Posts: 3
Once the SCEA 5 version of the exam is generally available, does anyone know how Sun will approach the re-certification of all those who are already SCEA certified?

My understanding is that the Part 2 and 3 portions of both exams (SCEA 5 and the old SCEA) will be relatively similar. With that said, will those who are currently SCEA certified have to take Part 1,2,3 of the SCEA 5 exam, or perhaps only have to re-take Part 1 of the SCEA 5 exam?

To me it does not make sense to have to re-take Parts 2,3 of SCEA 5 since designing should be relatively independent of J2EE version.. but I would like your opinion..

My guess is that Sun will change Part 2 of the SCEA 5 exam to make it necessary for us to have to retake all portions of the SCEA 5..

Thanks
Sam
Elisabet Guldbrandsen
Greenhorn

Joined: Dec 21, 2006
Posts: 4
I don't think a re-certification will be much of an issue. The certificate will still be valid, my old SCJP for 1.3 is still valid. With the amount of time involved in taking the SCEA, I don't think many people will attempt re-certification in any case.
Theodore Casser
Ranch Hand

Joined: Mar 14, 2001
Posts: 1902

As I've pointed out to the folks at Sun Education, I think there needs to be an upgrade path. I concur with the fact that there's not really that much of a difference - I did my Part II with J2EE 1.4 technologies, as an example. I think my larger concern would be making sure that the basic knowledge is the same, and that the time required to do the SCEA a second time would likely deter a lot of candidates from updating.

That said, I think perhaps requiring current SCEA's to retake Part I might not be unreasonable.


Theodore Jonathan Casser
SCJP/SCSNI/SCBCD/SCWCD/SCDJWS/SCMAD/SCEA/MCTS/MCPD... and so many more letters than you can shake a stick at!
sam holmes
Greenhorn

Joined: Sep 07, 2007
Posts: 3
I agree that having to retake the Part 1 of the exam makes sense. After all that is where the big change between the J2EE 1.2 and JEE 5 is reflected.

Is there some way to petition Sun on the SCEA to SCEA5 migration path? I called up Sun to talk about this and they told me that they have not yet decided.

Sam
Theodore Casser
Ranch Hand

Joined: Mar 14, 2001
Posts: 1902

Originally posted by sam holmes:
Is there some way to petition Sun on the SCEA to SCEA5 migration path? I called up Sun to talk about this and they told me that they have not yet decided.


I think then that we ought to start lobbying them in the near future. Perhaps see how many SCEAs are interested in having some form of simplified upgrade path. After all, the other exams have it...
Petr Kleja
Greenhorn

Joined: Nov 01, 2005
Posts: 29
Originally posted by Theodore Casser:


I think then that we ought to start lobbying them in the near future. Perhaps see how many SCEAs are interested in having some form of simplified upgrade path. After all, the other exams have it...


I think there is no need to recertificate for us who already are SCEA. I think that to be an SCEA means besides other things the fact an architect is the proof of ability and capability to absorb and perceive new technologies and trends in order to make right decisions and judgements. Besides this note I think nobody has time to recertificate. It is better to learn something new also about other technologies. Believe me. It gives you a lot of different new views and ideas.
But generally speaking I am not against possibility for recertification in part 1.

Petr
SCEA/SCBCD/SCDJWS/SCJP/SCMAD/SCWCD
MCP(70-536)
Deepak Bala
Bartender

Joined: Feb 24, 2006
Posts: 6661
    
    5

Recertification for part 1 would be fine but i doubt if they would arrange something like that. It does make sense to do it this way since not much would change for part 2 and 3. The design patterns and logic behind a design would pretty much be the same even though the technology behind java changes a touch.


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Theodore Casser
Ranch Hand

Joined: Mar 14, 2001
Posts: 1902

For what it's worth, I got an email response from Sun Learning yesterday that "It would be highly unusual for a SCEA 5.0 upgrade exam not to be released. Please be patient. The upgrade exams are typically released shortly after the standard exam is offered. (After the beta phase)"

So, I wouldn't worry so much.
Deepak Bala
Bartender

Joined: Feb 24, 2006
Posts: 6661
    
    5

Originally posted by Theodore Casser:
For what it's worth, I got an email response from Sun Learning yesterday that "It would be highly unusual for a SCEA 5.0 upgrade exam not to be released. Please be patient. The upgrade exams are typically released shortly after the standard exam is offered. (After the beta phase)"

So, I wouldn't worry so much.


That is cool and promising to hear
Billy Tsai
Ranch Hand

Joined: May 23, 2003
Posts: 1297
my guess is the official exam and the upgrade exam will be out sometime in the end of this year or begining of next year.
Lets hope the upgrade exam is not too lengthy or its going to take a while to prepare.


BEA 8.1 Certified Administrator, IBM Certified Solution Developer For XML 1.1 and Related Technologies, SCJP, SCWCD, SCBCD, SCDJWS, SCJD, SCEA,
Oracle Certified Master Java EE 5 Enterprise Architect
Petr Kleja
Greenhorn

Joined: Nov 01, 2005
Posts: 29
Originally posted by Theodore Casser:
For what it's worth, I got an email response from Sun Learning yesterday that "It would be highly unusual for a SCEA 5.0 upgrade exam not to be released. Please be patient. The upgrade exams are typically released shortly after the standard exam is offered. (After the beta phase)"

So, I wouldn't worry so much.


Nice to hear it.
But let us be more pragmatic. You want to be SCEA 5.0 as soon as possible I see. Ok. But are you really ready for it ? The main difference between old and new one has to be in using of a new EJB 3.0 persistence model and other things like AJAX and so on. It completely redesign architecture between layers. There is no more need to create "custom" value objects for instance etc.
I am working on a project with EJB 3.0 almost all the year and I think before going to SCEA 5.0 a responsible professional should upgrade his/her SCBCD to EJB 3.0. That will certainly be my first step, because I am already thoroughly prepared for it. Next step could be SCWCD with AJAX etc.
That is my 2 cents to eager 5.0 architects :-)

Petr
SCEA/SCBCD/SCJP/SCDJWS/SCMAD/SCWCD
MCP(70-536)
(also IBM iSeries Developer - 15 years :-))
Jesus Angeles
Ranch Hand

Joined: Feb 26, 2005
Posts: 2049
Originally posted by Petr Kleja:


Nice to hear it.
But let us be more pragmatic. You want to be SCEA 5.0 as soon as possible I see. Ok. But are you really ready for it ? The main difference between old and new one has to be in using of a new EJB 3.0 persistence model and other things like AJAX and so on. It completely redesign architecture between layers. There is no more need to create "custom" value objects for instance etc.
I am working on a project with EJB 3.0 almost all the year and I think before going to SCEA 5.0 a responsible professional should upgrade his/her SCBCD to EJB 3.0. That will certainly be my first step, because I am already thoroughly prepared for it. Next step could be SCWCD with AJAX etc.
That is my 2 cents to eager 5.0 architects :-)

Petr
SCEA/SCBCD/SCJP/SCDJWS/SCMAD/SCWCD
MCP(70-536)
(also IBM iSeries Developer - 15 years :-))



I agree. We can study the new things not in the old SCEA, and still be up to date.

As with the exam, Ill guess that only Part 1 will be retaken, for upgrade. It is because, whatever new stuff for Part 2/3, can be put in Part 1. In addition, we already did use the latest UML version (at least those who took it recently). And as a matter of fact, I did include EJB 3 in my Part 2/3.
Theodore Casser
Ranch Hand

Joined: Mar 14, 2001
Posts: 1902

Originally posted by Billy Tsai:
my guess is the official exam and the upgrade exam will be out sometime in the end of this year or begining of next year.
Lets hope the upgrade exam is not too lengthy or its going to take a while to prepare.


Beginning of next, probably end 1Q08 - my only guess on that is due to the fact that Part II/III is due by 26 December 2007, and I'm factoring in eight weeks for grading (normal for beta, and for SCEA), which would be the end of February 2008. So assume they'll go gold with the new SCEA in March 2008, with an upgrade shortly thereafter.

I'll have more questions eventually myself, no worries.
 
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subject: Taking SCEA 5 exam for those already SCEA (old) certified
 
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