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SCEA or SCBCD

Pawanpreet Singh
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jun 12, 2005
Posts: 264

Hi Everyone,

I am SCJP 5.0 and SCWCD 1.4. I would like to go for SCEA and not for SCBCD. Is it right way to go. My interest is more in SCEA.

Please let me know also which is new version for SCEA and which book i should go for exam I, II and III.


Thanks
Pawan
Hong Anderson
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jul 05, 2005
Posts: 1936
I think it's the wrong way

You know, EJB is Sun's beloved technology. How you become Sun Certified Enterprise Architect without good knowledge about EJB?

Perhaps, you can be a very excellent Java Enterprise Architect who don't use EJB at all, but I'm sure that Sun don't admire you

I recommend SCBCD first, and then SCEA.

New version of SCEA is SCEA for Java EE 5, it will be available next year.
[ December 19, 2007: Message edited by: Kengkaj Sathianpantarit ]

SCJA 1.0, SCJP 1.4, SCWCD 1.4, SCBCD 1.3, SCJP 5.0, SCEA 5, SCBCD 5; OCUP - Fundamental, Intermediate and Advanced; IBM Certified Solution Designer - OOAD, vUML 2; SpringSource Certified Spring Professional
Chintan Rajyaguru
Ranch Hand

Joined: Aug 19, 2001
Posts: 341
Unless Kengkaj's response was sarcastic or joke, I disagree with it completely. You don't pick a certification based on what is Sun's favorite technology or what Sun admires. You pick the certification based on whether it matches your prior experience, your chosen career path and whether you are ready to take the certification and assume the role that the certification is intended for.

Having said that, SCBCD and SCEA are intended for different audiences and apply at different levels. SCBCD tests your ability to write code using EJB technology. SCEA tests your ability to design solutions and create architectures that may involve EJB technology. SCBCD exam is all about EJBs but in case of SCEA, EJB is just one topic.

How do you decide? Do you want to learn to write code using EJB or do you want to design solutions? Do you consider yourself a developer who develops applications or an architect/senior developer who designs applications. Are you ready to learn and use bunch of other things (messaging, security, design patterns and much more) SCEA certification includes?

If your interest is in SCEA certification, go for it as it doesn't have any prerequisites. Just make sure that your are ready to be an architect. Certification alone won't help you there. You need to have experience, ability to evaluate [often conflicting] requirements, knowledge of vast array of tools and technologies, ability to pick the right technology for the given problem and much more...

Good luck!


ChintanRajyaguru.com
SOADevelopment.com - Coming soon!
Juan Pablo Crossley
Ranch Hand

Joined: Oct 16, 2007
Posts: 128
Both of you are right, but if you ask me take the SCBCD first and then go for the SCEA, the SCEA is easy if you have a very good knowledge of SCWCD and SCBCD, off course, you can go directly to SCEA without any other certification... but how will trust you a design if you don't certify that you know what you're talking about?

I mean, if you put an EJB in your design you must know what an EJB is, what are its advantages, and so on (that's tested by SCEA), but if you didn't coded any EJB how will you know the better way to use it?

if you have the SCEA but don't have any other certification I will not admire you


SCJP, SCBCD, SCEA 5, MCP

How to pass SCEA 5 | 2, 3, N-tier which one should I pick? | Analysis of persistence layer from SCEA 5 perspective | Swing... why not?
Chintan Rajyaguru
Ranch Hand

Joined: Aug 19, 2001
Posts: 341
Juan,
You don't want to hire an architect solely based on SCEA or any other certification. So how will they trust your design if you don't certify that you know what you are talking about? You use your prior experience, publications, blogs, references and interview but you certainly don't need SCBCD to prove that. Don't get me wrong here. Having SCBCD helps by all means. Among other things, it may help prove that as an architect, you come from development background.

Also, you don't want to admire (or not admire) an architect simply based on whether he has any certification in addition to SCEA. You want to admire an architect based on his ability to make architectural decisions and deliver the system that works, is business aligned and is in line with the constraints posed by the organization.

My 2 cents...

C
Edit: Grammer/typo correction
[ December 26, 2007: Message edited by: Chintan Rajyaguru ]
Chintan Rajyaguru
Ranch Hand

Joined: Aug 19, 2001
Posts: 341
I also wanted to add that your architect may not have taken SCBCD and hence may not be able to answer (say) which package contains ObjectNotFoundException but that doesn't make him a bad architect. It's just that he is not a good fit for the position you are trying to fill.

I have sat in interviews on both sides of the table and I have learned that candidates are never good or bad, they just aren't good fit sometimes.

C
Paul Michael
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jul 02, 2001
Posts: 697
Originally posted by Pawan preet:
Hi Everyone,

I am SCJP 5.0 and SCWCD 1.4. I would like to go for SCEA and not for SCBCD. Is it right way to go. My interest is more in SCEA.

Please let me know also which is new version for SCEA and which book i should go for exam I, II and III.


Thanks
Pawan


Hi Pawan, I do not want to go into details of whether you should take SCBCD first before taking SCEA. The other posts already gave us enough background on that matter.

As for preparations, I would suggest reading Mark Cade's book for Part I and II of the exam. I took SCEA Part I last April without much EJB knowledge and got 91% overall. I just tried to grasp the concepts using the resources available (plus section on EJB lifecycle from SCBCD Study Guide) and did some simple exercises. I downloaded the assignment a few months after and was also involved in preparing for SCEA 5 Beta Part II but didn't have time to complete the assignment due to external factors. Looking at the Part II exam of the current SCEA and SCEA 5 Beta, I think Mark Cade's book will really be beneficial because of the Case Study section of the book. You will also need a copy of Core J2EE Patterns book if you're thinking of designing a JEE 1.4 solution. But please note that some of the contents of that book are not applicable for JEE 5.

Hope this helps.


[ January 02, 2008: Message edited by: Michael Guevara ]

SCJP 1.2 (89%), SCWCD 1.3 (94%), IBM 486 (90%), SCJA Beta (96%), SCEA (91% / 77%), SCEA 5 P1 (77%), SCBCD 5 (85%)
Pawanpreet Singh
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jun 12, 2005
Posts: 264

Thanks to Kengkaj,Chintan and Michael for providing this knowledge.

I also do agree with Mr. Chintan's advice. I have some knowledge of EJB and know that there is one section of this in SCEA that i will handle. So decided to go for SCEA 5.

BTW what is BETA exam.
Pawanpreet Singh
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jun 12, 2005
Posts: 264

Hi Michael,

You have mentioned..

"I would suggest reading Mark Cade's book for Part I and II of the exam". I just need to confirm is this for SCEA 1.4 or SCEA 5.0 and is there any change in syllabus.
Chintan Rajyaguru
Ranch Hand

Joined: Aug 19, 2001
Posts: 341
Originally posted by Pawan preet:

BTW what is BETA exam.


Sun is coming up with a new version of SCEA exam (should be out by Feb 2008). Typically, when Sun comes out with a new version of an exam, it starts with so called beta exam, which is about 4 hours long with more questions than the regular exam. Sun invites people to take the exam (for free) and also allows people to register on their website (for free). If you pass the beta exam you get the certification. Sun uses beta exam to test the exam itself before the exam goes live to public. I believe you have to fill out a survey about the exam, which further helps Sun finalize the exam.

You missed your opportunity to take the SCEA beta exam because the beta testing period has ended. I heard Sun is working on SCBCD beta and then eventually will get to SCDJWS beta. If you keep an eye on Sun certification website, you may be able to register for beta when it comes out and get certified for free!

Hope this helps...

C
Pawanpreet Singh
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jun 12, 2005
Posts: 264

Thank you Chintan.
Narendra Dhande
Ranch Hand

Joined: Dec 04, 2004
Posts: 950
Hi Chintan,

You missed your opportunity to take the SCEA beta exam because the beta testing period has ended. I heard Sun is working on SCBCD beta and then eventually will get to SCDJWS beta.



SCBCD 5 is already live. For which version of SCBCD Beta you heard.

Thanks


Narendra Dhande
SCJP 1.4,SCWCD 1.4, SCBCD 5.0, SCDJWS 5.0, SCEA 5.0
Hong Anderson
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jul 05, 2005
Posts: 1936
Originally posted by Chintan Rajyaguru:

I heard Sun is working on SCBCD beta and then eventually will get to SCDJWS beta.

Do you mean SCWCD beta?
Cameron Wallace McKenzie
author and cow tipper
Saloon Keeper

Joined: Aug 26, 2006
Posts: 4968
    
    1

I think the SCEA exam is the most coveted. It looks better on a resume, IMHO.

-Cameron McKenzie
Chintan Rajyaguru
Ranch Hand

Joined: Aug 19, 2001
Posts: 341
Narendra and Kengkaj,
Thanks for pointing out. I meant SCWCD (Servlet and JSP) exam. I guess I should start using descriptions rather than acronyms.

C
Paul Michael
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jul 02, 2001
Posts: 697
Originally posted by Pawan preet:
Hi Michael,

You have mentioned..

"I would suggest reading Mark Cade's book for Part I and II of the exam". I just need to confirm is this for SCEA 1.4 or SCEA 5.0 and is there any change in syllabus.


The Case Study part from Mark Cade's book is applicable for Part II of both SCEA Old and SCEA 5. For Part I, I'm afraid this book is not enough to get a good score (for both versions). I'm still preparing a mind map of all the resources (mostly online) I used for the exam. I'll keep you updated on the progress.
 
Don't get me started about those stupid light bulbs.
 
subject: SCEA or SCBCD