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To those that Passed with 80% or above

Randall Stevens
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jul 01, 2003
Posts: 65
Can you please post the list of resources that you used to pass the exam? Please include any URLs that were also of benefit.
Although I recognize all those that passed, my selection criteria is based on the belief that higher score means more in-depth knowledge of the material. As I did not pass, I want to insure my success the next time I attempt the exam.
I used EJB 2.0 Specification, the exam objectives and part of the preliminary information from Headfirst EJB.
Pradeep bhatt
Ranch Hand

Joined: Feb 27, 2002
Posts: 8919

Although I recognize all those that passed, my selection criteria is based on the belief that higher score means more in-depth knowledge of the material.

I dont agree with you !


Groovy
Pradeep bhatt
Ranch Hand

Joined: Feb 27, 2002
Posts: 8919

I just used the spec and the EJB Orielly book for the exam and nothing else.
Kathy and Bert have posted mock question in this forum. They are relly helpful.
Resources link
http://www.ourbangla.com/scbcdbetaexam.doc
http://www.geocities.com/rahmanjava
Max Uustalu
Greenhorn

Joined: Aug 22, 2003
Posts: 4
Randall,
I used only EJB specification, it has all U need. Btw I got 91%
SCJP
SCWCD
SCBCD
Juan Rolando Prieur-Reza
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jun 20, 2003
Posts: 236
Originally posted by Pradeep Bhat:
Kathy and Bert have posted mock question in this forum. They are relly helpful.

I missed that posting. Would you kindly tell us where that is? a link?
Thanks
John


Juan Rolando Prieur-Reza, M.S., LSSBB, SCEA, SCBCD, SCWCD, SCJP/1.6, IBM OOAD, SCSA
Randall Stevens
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jul 01, 2003
Posts: 65
I dont agree with you !

Does that mean that your score of 90% was just luck and not knowledge?
If so does that mean you agree that certifications do not mean anything?
Randall Stevens
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jul 01, 2003
Posts: 65
I used only EJB specification, it has all U need.

And can you tell me how much experience in EJBs do you have? I studied the specification as did many others that did not pass, I have 2 years of EJB experience prior to the EJB 2.0 spec. I think the roles may have been what did me in, but won't know until I get my letter from Sun with the breakdown.
Gary Mann
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jun 05, 2003
Posts: 37
I don't know if this helps because each person learns in their own way, but here's what I did.
I knew nothing about EJBs when I started - no prior experience. Firstly, I read Enterprise JavaBeans from O'Reilly. I went through each chapter and made detailed notes. This gave me a good sense of how EJB's are used. If you already have EJB programming experience, this step may not help you.
Secondly, I studied the exam objectives, and then went through the spec in detail making more notes (about 40 pages of A4/letter paper). The objectives tell you exactly what you need to know - match them up to the spec.
Finally, I reviewed the notes and created a few "cheat sheets" for subjects such as what methods are allowed for each bean type and transactions. I learned these sheets ready for the exam.
I passed with 95%. I think SCWCD and SCBCD certification tests come down to knowing exactly is required and studying the spec like crazy. They are not related to programming ability.
Good Luck when you take the exam again.
Max Uustalu
Greenhorn

Joined: Aug 22, 2003
Posts: 4
Randall,
I have something like 2 years of experience too, but that's not the point. I'm totally agree with Gray Man, SCBCD passing score (as well SCWCD) is just a matter of how deeply you caved into the details of spec during your preparation.
Regards
SCJP
SCWCD
SCBCD
Pradeep bhatt
Ranch Hand

Joined: Feb 27, 2002
Posts: 8919

Originally posted by Randall Stevens:

And can you tell me how much experience in EJBs do you have? I studied the specification as did many others that did not pass, I have 2 years of EJB experience prior to the EJB 2.0 spec. I think the roles may have been what did me in, but won't know until I get my letter from Sun with the breakdown.

I guess you did not study it properly
Pradeep bhatt
Ranch Hand

Joined: Feb 27, 2002
Posts: 8919

Originally posted by Randall Stevens:

Does that mean that your score of 90% was just luck and not knowledge?
If so does that mean you agree that certifications do not mean anything?

My score was because of my knowledge and not luck.
Whatmade you feel that persons who score more than 80% have pointers to the right resources ? Persons who failed may also know the right resources/links required for the exam. They may have failed due to other reasons. Nothing else!

Pradeep bhatt
Ranch Hand

Joined: Feb 27, 2002
Posts: 8919

Originally posted by john prieur:

I missed that posting. Would you kindly tell us where that is? a link?
Thanks
John

http://www.ourbangla.com/scbcdbetaexam.doc
Search this forum with string "mock" and you will find many.
Why did you use ??
Randall Stevens
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jul 01, 2003
Posts: 65
I guess you did not study it properly

I admit that I did not study as I would have liked.
I would like to get all the information that I need to properly prepare so that when I retry later this year then I will pass.
Randall Stevens
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jul 01, 2003
Posts: 65
Persons who failed may also know the right resources/links required for the exam. They may have failed due to other reasons.

True.
My thinking was to create a bare essentials list that was backed by proven success. For example, I failed the exam and although some information in the book Client/Server Programming with Java and CORBA might be of interest, its effectiveness in helping to study and ultimately pass the SCBCD is questionable. Also, the book Writing EJBs with IBM VisualAge for Java has some interesting information about EJBs, but its coverage of the EJB Spec was limited (and on a different version of the EJB spec). I wanted to eliminate references to resources that add little to no value.
Pradeep bhatt
Ranch Hand

Joined: Feb 27, 2002
Posts: 8919

Hi Randall,
I am sure that you will able to get a very good score.

I would suggest you to wait for Kathys book.
When in doubt please post your queries here. There are many certified guys here to help you out.
Wish you the best!
Eric Ma
Greenhorn

Joined: Nov 21, 2001
Posts: 16
Originally posted by Randall Stevens:
...I think the roles may have been what did me in...

I also hate the "Roles" stuff in the exam. Who gives a damn in the real world?
If I were you (having more than 2 years of EJB exprience), I wouldn't worry about getting a SCBCD certificate at all. IMHO, half of the EJB specs are going away soon (all the entity beans stuff), so if you have used SLSB and MDB, consider yourself a EJB master.
Kathy Sierra
Cowgirl and Author
Ranch Hand

Joined: Oct 10, 2002
Posts: 1572
Howdy
Well, entity beans *are* staying in the spec, for at least the next two years... EJB 2.1 isn't even out yet, and it hasn't taken anything away from entity beans, but has gone further to refine things (like improvements to EJBQL, for example). I'm not making any kind of value or political judgement on entity beans here; just clarifying that they are definitely NOT coming out of the spec.
If you've seen the upcoming 2.1 spec, the main thing it adds is all the support for Web Services. That's what will change when the SCBCD is updated, which won't be for at least 1.5 years from now...
As for the roles -- I know somewhere in this forum we had some debates about that. The J2EE team believes that component-based development is a crucial part of developing large-scale systems, and that understanding where the separations lie is about understanding how to write reusable components, rather than defining what different *people* actually do. So they consider this key knowledge for someone who is certified. In other words, this tells whoever is hiring you, for example, that you are not just a good bean programmer, but that you understand the overall concepts of how to write *reusable* components.
This understanding of roles is as close as the *current* SCBCD exam comes to testing on best-practices, for example. Since we don't test on patterns (next version of the exam will, I think), but we do expect you to know, for example, which aspects of a bean can (and should) be modified at deploy time, rather than hard-coded into the bean. For example, understanding the point in the process (and the role responsible) where mapping references happens, might seem subtle and trivial, but it's a fundamental part of what the J2EE team considers one of the most important aspects of the J2EE application programming model.
Gee, don't I just sound like I came from a marketing meeting? Too many meetings at Sun recently Stop me if I start going all Dilbert on you...
Anyway, if you think of the questions on *roles* as really questions on *component-based development*, I'm hoping that will make them perhaps a *little* bit easier to swallow. And just remember, there are only a tiny handful of questions about this on the real exam.
cheers,
Kathy

<plug>Did you know you can take a Caribbean cruise and certification course for SCBCD... at the same time? I'm teaching an SCBCD certification preparation course on the next Java Jam IV GeekCruise. You can take the class *and* the cruise for less than a typical five-day IT course. Ask me for details </plug>
Eric Ma
Greenhorn

Joined: Nov 21, 2001
Posts: 16
With due respect, I have to disagree.
Well, entity beans *are* staying in the spec, for at least the next two years

I know entity beans are staying in the EJB spec, but let me ask this: among the people who took the SCBCD beta exam, how many are using them in the way Sun envisions people to use entity beans, i.e, as distributed components? I have not used entity beans for a year now and I am not looking back. If something in the spec is not well received by the community, I consider it as irrelevant.
This understanding of roles is as close as the *current* SCBCD exam comes to testing on best-practices, for example. Since we don't test on patterns (next version of the exam will, I think), but we do expect you to know, for example, which aspects of a bean can (and should) be modified at deploy time, rather than hard-coded into the bean. For example, understanding the point in the process (and the role responsible) where mapping references happens, might seem subtle and trivial, but it's a fundamental part of what the J2EE team considers one of the most important aspects of the J2EE application programming model.

To me, the definition of 5 (or is it 4) EJB roles are just so artificial. I only see two roles - J2EE developer and app server administrator, just like in the database world. Developer, Deployer, Assembler ... has anyone seen a job ad for a Deployer or an Assembler? Testing knowledge on the roles has nothing to do with testing patterns on component development. In the real world, the deployment descriptor is generated by XDoclet, which is written by the developer, not the "deployer". Would you say this is a poor practice?
Kathy Sierra
Cowgirl and Author
Ranch Hand

Joined: Oct 10, 2002
Posts: 1572
Originally posted by Eric Ma:
With due respect, I have to disagree.
I know entity beans are staying in the EJB spec, but let me ask this: among the people who took the SCBCD beta exam, how many are using them in the way Sun envisions people to use entity beans, i.e, as distributed components?

Ah... different issue . That's why I said, "I'm not making any kind of value or political judgement on entity beans here; just clarifying that they are definitely NOT coming out of the spec. "
The debate about whether they *should* be is better suited for the EJB forum, not this cert prep forum. Our job is here is to help those who are going to take the exam, which at this point is already finalized. Your opinion about whether people should *not* take the exam is important for this forum, but any other debate about the value of the technology itself should move to the EJB forum.

As for the role questions, we don't believe there are separate job titles, or separate people doing these tasks. This is more about the 'hats' a developer wears, and the stages of development. The J2EE team (and others) do believe that component-based development *is* increasing, and that the longer the application programming model exists, the more likely it is that components will begin to see more reuse. In these still-early days, more components are being created just-in-time to fulfill the needs of an application, where the future *hope* is that as more applications are developed in the future, beans built for those earlier apps will begin to be recruited into service again, in which case it *will* be much more likely that the development of the component and the assembly into an app can be very distinct stages (and people).
But keep in mind too that this *is* a Sun exam , and Sun is certainly going to have a bias for testing on its own programming model / blueprint. We assume that anyone who is interested in the exam either as a candidate or perhaps employer, will recognize that there may be areas (correction -- WILL be areas) where Sun is not 100% reflecting the *actual* real world of development today, but is in part helping to *lead* the direction they expect -- or want -- development to move.
I'm not in any way connected to the J2EE team, but I do know that both Sun PS and the J2EE team are heavily connected to customers -- both bean developers and server vendors -- so they are heavily responsible for listening and responding to customer feedback.
I suspect that other non-Sun EJB certification exams will have a different mix and emphasis of topics, so it really depends on what someone's goal is in taking the exam.
In any case, I think people have become too excited about the role questions, because there appeared to be so many of them on the beta exam. One could pass the exam without ever glancing at the parts of the spec dealing with roles, because there are SO few questions about it.
So while I personally think they're important, and I know what we at least *believed* we were testing for (understanding of the process, not so much who does what), nobody should really get too worked up about these questions. If you hate the whole idea, then simply skip it.
It *is* true that it would probably be impossible to pass without sufficient entity bean knowledge, though. But again, anyone who is interested in the exam, at this point, will have to accept what is in the specification, since it is a Sun exam.
Your opinion, Eric, on value of the certification *does* belong in this forum, but debates about the technologies themselves belong in the EJB forum rather than here in the cert prep forum. If the issue is about what exactly IS on the exam, there isn't anything we can do about that here -- the exam is complete, and we're stuck with it for at least the next 18 months. If the J2EE team and Sun PS have a different view of the world at that point, based on their close relationships with developer customers, then the exam will certainly change to reflect that. But there isn't anything we can do *here* except prepare for the current exam as it is now.
If you have feedback on the exam topics, this is not the place -- but I STRONGLY encourage you to write directly to Sun certification. They take comments very seriously (I know, sometimes I'm the one who has to answer the customer, and I get in a world of trouble if I'm not quick about it )
cheers and thanks,
Kathy
Randall Stevens
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jul 01, 2003
Posts: 65
Which areas of the spec should one focus the most effort on?
The areas listed on the score report are below:
- Client view of Session bean
- Session bean component contract
- Session bean lifecycle
- Client view of an entity
- Component contract for container-managed persistence
- CMP Entity bean lifecycle
- Entity beans
- EJB-QL
- Message-driven bean component contract
- Transactions
- Exceptions
- Enterprise bean environment
- Security management
My best scores were in Client view of an entity, CMP entity bean lifecycle, Entity beans, Message-driven bean component contract, and Enterprise bean environment.
Randall Stevens
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jul 01, 2003
Posts: 65
Another book to add the list above is Developing Business Components as Enterprise JavaBeans by Skillsoft Press.
Manjunath Subramanian
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jul 18, 2001
Posts: 236
Another very good book which is often not discussed,because of its low awareness, is the SL-351 courseware that comes as part of the EJB training from SUN.
If any of your friends are doing this course, try to get the book from
them and go through it.It definitely gives you a good head start!
Ishita Gupta
Greenhorn

Joined: Jan 03, 2003
Posts: 18
Hi Kathy,
When is your book on SCBCD certification getting published?
Thanx
Ishita
-SCJP2 1.4
Siju Odeyemi
Greenhorn

Joined: Jan 16, 2003
Posts: 10
Hi Kathy Sierra!
Just wanted to say Hi, I've never spoken to a Java celebrity before!
I've been a Java/J2EE Developer (SCJP, SCWCD and studying for SCD & SCBCD)in the UK for about a year now and I'm waiting on your book (Amazon.co.uk on the 30th of Sept). I can't wait to pass it.
Again thanks for the book!!!
--Siju
Manjunath Subramanian
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jul 18, 2001
Posts: 236
Originally posted by siju odeyemi:

Just wanted to say Hi, I've never spoken to a Java celebrity before!


WOW! There are some BIG fans here for the Cowgirl!
Just Kidding,
Manjunath
Tony Collins
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jul 03, 2003
Posts: 435
Originally posted by Kathy Sierra:


<plug>Did you know you can take a Caribbean cruise and certification course for SCBCD... at the same time? I'm teaching an SCBCD certification preparation course on the next Java Jam IV GeekCruise. You can take the class *and* the cruise for less than a typical five-day IT course. Ask me for details </plug>

Let me get this right, your plugging a week on a boat full of Software Engineers, learning about software Engineering. What a great holiday where can I sign up.
Cheers Tony
Ishita Gupta
Greenhorn

Joined: Jan 03, 2003
Posts: 18
Hi Randall Stevens,
Dont loose ur confidence jus bcoz u havent made it thru the SCBCD.
Simply keep this in mind
"Succes is never final, failure is never fatal. Its the courage that counts"
Thanx
-SCJP
-Preparing SCBCD
Michael Alen Chang
Greenhorn

Joined: Jun 27, 2003
Posts: 9
Passed yesterday 84%
Write some EJB first
I use J2EE reference implementation and MySQL to test my EJB
And read EJB 2.0 spec twice
It takes me 1 month


Regard,<br />Michael<br />SCJP 1.2, SCJP 1.4, SCWCD 1.3, SCBCD 1.3, SCJA 1.0
 
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