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Ask SUN to support J2ME on Pocket PC

Michael Yuan
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Joined: Mar 07, 2002
Posts: 1427
There are two threads on today's Java Lobby about J2ME support on PocketPC devices. They ask SUN to release its Personal Profile implementation for PPCs. But Sun is relunctant to do so due to the high cost. Since PPC support is a frequently discussed topic on this forum, I think some of you might be interested to show your support and make your voice heard by Sun.
J2ME CDC for PocketPC ARM
Sun J2ME's last stand on Pocket PC


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dan moore
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Joined: Nov 04, 2001
Posts: 68
Michael,
Not sure what more can be said. If they can't think beyond the profitability of a single department / project creating essentially free software to their technology's main selling point and their position in a multi-billion dollar market, what can you do? Some of the letters are very good, but are obviously falling on wrong ears. Sorry, don't know anyone "up there" at Sun.
An aside though, seems that Sun are missing the point similarly in .NET on mobile phones, allowing Smartphones to enter marketplace without free VM to run Java on them. Suddenly Java isn't "run everywhere" on mobiles and suddenly less compelling, not automatic choice for integration with backend etc. etc. oh dear.
Good luck, haven't posted to your links as i think the posters already said it all much more eloquently.
cheers, dan.


dan moore, infomatiq ltd.<br />email dan@infomatiq.co.uk<br /><a href="http://www.infomatiq.co.uk" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.infomatiq.co.uk</a>
Billy Tsai
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Joined: May 23, 2003
Posts: 1304
maybe the phDs in Sun are too lazy


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Daryl Wilding-McBride
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Joined: Jul 18, 2003
Posts: 60
Why not lobby vendors such as Esmertec and IBM to release a PP implementation on the PocketPC? They can't be too far away from having a final release available, since the TCK is now available.
As I understand it, Sun's preferred position is to get the device vendors to release implementations, rather than doing it themselves. I think that's reasonable, because the device vendors have the most to gain from the implementation's success.


Daryl Wilding-McBride<br />Author of "Java Development on PDAs" (ISBN 0-201-71954-1)<br /><a href="http://www.javaonpdas.com" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">http://www.javaonpdas.com</a>
Michael Yuan
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Joined: Mar 07, 2002
Posts: 1427
Well, IBM does have a PPro VM for PPC freely available to developers. I do not know why people overlooked that. Or is it because IBM marketing is bad?
dan moore
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Joined: Nov 04, 2001
Posts: 68
it's not even just IBM's marketing I don't think - we are in the UK and earlier this year spent days trying to talk to someone about licensing costs for the J9 VM - we'd been using it for development for a while. it was about the time they re-branded everything to WebSphere, but the only UK sales guys you could get to talk to were J2EE websphere people who got very confused about ARM chips and micro environments. not very joined-up at all.
back on main point, i didn't think the issue was whether these VMs are available though, i thought it was about cost (although this could be a perception thing - maybe the licensing costs are a lot lower than assumed - does anyone have ballpark figures?) - the example i saw on your links was 50 bucks VM licensing, so who's going to pay 57 bucks for some little app when they can get the native one for 7? if Sun had a free VM that $7 basic app becomes workable, ppl develop in Java, ship low-end consumer versions on Sun and then the more refined implementations (from IBM, esmertec, insignia etc.) sell to reduce footprint, make apps slicker, extra reliability etc. for enterprise app versions that have higher margins and requirements.
cheers, dan.
Fred Grott
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Joined: Oct 05, 2002
Posts: 346
Originally posted by Daryl Wilding-McBride:
Why not lobby vendors such as Esmertec and IBM to release a PP implementation on the PocketPC? They can't be too far away from having a final release available, since the TCK is now available.
As I understand it, Sun's preferred position is to get the device vendors to release implementations, rather than doing it themselves. I think that's reasonable, because the device vendors have the most to gain from the implementation's success.

Daryl Esmertec has one in fact it was demoed recently..in fact I have the emualtor becuase its the only one plugable into Brew emlation at the moment..
IBM I know is releasing oen this fall..


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Theodore Casser
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Joined: Mar 14, 2001
Posts: 1902

Originally posted by Michael Yuan:
Well, IBM does have a PPro VM for PPC freely available to developers. I do not know why people overlooked that. Or is it because IBM marketing is bad?

Actually, for instance, this is the first time I'd heard of it. I don't know that it's really bad marketing on IBM's part or just general trouble sometimes in getting out any word at all to developers on what they have in their corral.


Theodore Jonathan Casser
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Daryl Wilding-McBride
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Joined: Jul 18, 2003
Posts: 60
Originally posted by dan moore:
back on main point, i didn't think the issue was whether these VMs are available though, i thought it was about cost (although this could be a perception thing - maybe the licensing costs are a lot lower than assumed - does anyone have ballpark figures?)

The WebSphere Micro Environment including a Personal Profile beta is USD$5.99 for one licence on Handango.
 
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