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Post interview follow up

Manish Hatwalne
Ranch Hand

Joined: Sep 22, 2001
Posts: 2578

I don't know how do I put this, but let me try -
Recently in an interview, I had 2/3 confusing questions. During the interview, I thought I got them wrong, mainly because of the reaction of the interviewers. But, when I came home and checked it with API and JLS I found I was right abt all 3 Qs (One Swing and 2 general). The only "bad" thing abt the interview was that I was a little rusty on my UDP fundamentals, coz frankly I didn't expect questions on UDP. But now I'd say my overall interview was good.
I am interested in joining the company, mainly because of the work they do, though it's a small start-up company.
How can I follow up with the company? Proving them that I was right seems pretty inapproriate and rude. At the same time, I would like to let them know that I knew my subject well. How can I do this?
TIA,
- Manish
Mark Herschberg
Sheriff

Joined: Dec 04, 2000
Posts: 6037
Send them a thank you letter. In the letter, make comments about how you thought it didn't go well, but later confirmed your answers. Effectively, what you just said above. Obviously, you'll need to word it much differently.
Of course, if they really thought your answers were wrong, and you weren't, you have to wonder about their Java capabilities.
--Mark
Roseanne Zhang
Ranch Hand

Joined: Nov 14, 2000
Posts: 1953
If 3 questions counted as 2/3 of the interviews, then either ... or .. or ..
1) They did not take you seriously
2) They might not really know Java, and too afraid to ask.
3) You might be somewhere on another planet
Anyway, it did not happen in my about 10 years interview history. I usually got 5-10 times as much questons, from telephone interview to face-to-face. When I got my current job, 9 people about half a hour each rotation. The shortest I can remember was a company I had worked before in a different location, and also someone inside highly recommend me for that position, that interview went mostly to persuade me to go there, even so, I think I had more than 6 technical questions.
Anyway, following Mark's instruction will do no harm to you. Just try...
[ July 03, 2002: Message edited by: Roseanne Zhang ]
sprintup
Greenhorn

Joined: Jun 12, 2002
Posts: 19
Originally posted by Manish Hatwalne:
I don't know how do I put this, but let me try -
Recently in an interview, I had 2/3 confusing questions. During the interview, I thought I got them wrong, mainly because of the reaction of the interviewers. But, when I came home and checked it with API and JLS I found I was right abt all 3 Qs (One Swing and 2 general). The only "bad" thing abt the interview was that I was a little rusty on my UDP fundamentals, coz frankly I didn't expect questions on UDP. But now I'd say my overall interview was good.
I am interested in joining the company, mainly because of the work they do, though it's a small start-up company.
How can I follow up with the company? Proving them that I was right seems pretty inapproriate and rude. At the same time, I would like to let them know that I knew my subject well. How can I do this?
TIA,
- Manish

Email them, saying that you are still confused about the questions and wants to meet 'genius' interviewers again for that purpose.

If they call,you can correct them(ofcourse in polite way )during meeting(if they are wrong
)
Mark Herschberg
Sheriff

Joined: Dec 04, 2000
Posts: 6037
"sprintup",
Welcome to JavaRanch.
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Please look carefully at official naming policy at javaranch & reregister yourself with proper first & last name, with a space between them. Please adhere to official naming policy & help maintain the decorum of the forum. The naming policy can be found at http://www.javaranch.com/name.jsp
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--Mark
Manish Hatwalne
Ranch Hand

Joined: Sep 22, 2001
Posts: 2578

Originally posted by Mark Herschberg:
Of course, if they really thought your answers were wrong, and you weren't, you have to wonder about their Java capabilities.
--Mark

Hmmm, I'll have to draft my mail carefuly, that seems to be the only solution.
The interviewers were very senior guys, with RMI/Jini background. Probably, they didn't know what to ask in other general Java topics, it happens. Since they are in the process of building team, probably they didn't have right ppl to interview, or whatever....
Bottomline is - I need that job. It's employers market today, at least for my position.
This is for Roseanne Zhang
The interview did have lot of questions, and lasted for 40-50 minutes. I answered many questions correctly, and said "I do not know" for the Qs I didn't know. I was talking abt the 2/3 questions where I thought that the interviewers gave me that look which said - "Nah, you are wrong". The only mess up from my side (not counting these 2/3 Qs) was the way I handled UDP - TCP/IP question.
Anyway,
I guess I'll write them a carefully drafted mail .
Thanks,
- Manish
Pradip Bhat
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Joined: Jul 04, 2002
Posts: 149
Mark
I have reregistered myself as rahul rege.


Yeshwantpur
SJ Adnams
Ranch Hand

Joined: Sep 28, 2001
Posts: 925
Manish,
I had an interview in January where the guy asked me something like,
String a = "a";
String b = "a";
if( a == b )...
It's a pretty standard question in interviews, so I explained that a would equal b, and how the java runtime uses the same memory for strings that are the same. He looked at me like I was a fool and said that a != b.
I didn't hear back from that interview, but 4 months later got a much better job.
You don't need that job, the next interview will come along soon with a much better company believe me.
Simon
Jim Baiter
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jan 05, 2001
Posts: 532
He was right, equals would return true but since they are different object == is false.
Roseanne Zhang
Ranch Hand

Joined: Nov 14, 2000
Posts: 1953

Used jdk1.3.1, print out true. Jim, try it!
[ July 04, 2002: Message edited by: Roseanne Zhang ]
Jim Baiter
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jan 05, 2001
Posts: 532
Ok, you're right, the stack duh. Sorry.
[ July 04, 2002: Message edited by: Jim Baiter ]
Roseanne Zhang
Ranch Hand

Joined: Nov 14, 2000
Posts: 1953
Manish Hatwalne
Finally I figured out my confusion or your confusing expression. The culprit is the 2/3. You probably meant 2 or 3. I took it as 2 over 3, or two thirds. We could probably both learn something from this interesting experiences. Not bad!!!
Roseanne
Mark Herschberg
Sheriff

Joined: Dec 04, 2000
Posts: 6037
FYI, if you're ever in an interview, and get a question wrong, ask them what the right answer is. If you disagree with it, you can email them code proving them otherwise.
I never give answers to the questions I ask... unless the interviewee explicitly asks me for it. I don't even indicate if they got it right or wrong. :-)
--Mark
John Coxey
Ranch Hand

Joined: Oct 24, 2000
Posts: 503
Manish:
- I do hope that during your interview you asked about projects/applications that the company was working on - and that you might be invited to participate in.
- I also hope that you made mental notes regarding said projects - especially any major points, techinical names, and acronyms. Also, you should have asked for business cards at the interview.
---------
- For follow-up letter. Refer to your mental notes and make reference to how you can help on these projects. Specifically mention the acronyms, project names, or other relevant information.
Why?
1. It shows you did not sleep during the interview.
2. The follow-up letter itself shows that you are interested in the job and helps to separate your self from the crowd. Contrary to popular belief, only about 20% of the people invited in for an interview will ever send a thank-you note.
So make yours stand-out by recalling project names/etc.
3. Too hell with trying to justify your answer to a technical question. Let it go!!! You are on dangerous turf (even if you are postitive you are correct).
----------
What I think you guys are doing wrong on the technical interview:
- You are trying to meet the question head-on. If you do not know the answer, then state so - but don't just shut up. Try to turn the interrogation into a discussion. Perhaps you will find common ground with this person - and then you can let your knowledge run.
If you get really lucky - the interviewer will bring up the current project - and maybe you can run with the discussion and propose a possible solution.
Better yet - don't just talk about your solution - go to the whiteboard and start hacking the solution out. Use UML notation if you know it.
In doing this - you have completely turned the tables and taken control of the interview. Now it's YOU who are calling the shots. And, now you have not only demonstrated technical skills, but also leadership and communication skills.
-----
When the technical interview is over - leave your drawing on the board for the pinhead non-technical boss. These bozos just love to see charts and diagrams on white-board. You can then do a high-level (non-technical) discussion with the putz - and bingo - you scored the gig.
At the very least - you gained some insight as to what to say and what not to say for the next interview - in case this one doesn't land you the job.
------------
My feelings on the best way to prepare for a tech interview. Study for the SCJP2, SCWCD exams. 99% of any tech interview questions seem to follow directly from these topics.
Also - the tech interview questions are a hell of alot easier than the actual ones on the certification exams.
Johnny
(jpcoxey@aol.com)


John Coxey
Evansville, Indiana, USA
Mark Herschberg
Sheriff

Joined: Dec 04, 2000
Posts: 6037
Well said John.
--Mark
Manish Hatwalne
Ranch Hand

Joined: Sep 22, 2001
Posts: 2578

Thanks everybody for ur inputs!
Roseanne, you are right. By 2/3 I meant 2 or 3 questions, but 2/3 will be interpreted as two thirds. My mistake, I realize this. Next time, I'll put it as 2 or 3 OR 2-3. Thanks
John Coxey & Simon Lee -
Thanks a ton for very helpful and encouraging inputs, I agree with you John, general java interview questions are much easier than the SCJP exam questions. I have already passed my SCJP 2, and yesterday passed SCJP beta (1.4) as well. So I was well prepared for general Java Qs. But as I said earlier, the interviewers were two senior ppl from RMI/Jini background (that's the reason I want to work there, I want to that sort of work), and I haven't had a chance to work on either of them.
One question went like this -
Can u do this - Object obj = new Object();
I said yes, then he immediately asked me what's an abstract base class, I answered in rather details, and then said Object is NOT an abstract base class.
Then we went on to discuss some of the projects I did in my present job, we dicused abt socket programming, networks in general, IP fundamentals, class A, B, C etc. Which I believe I answered quite well.
The he asked me what's so special abt Swing besides enhanced looks and enhanced features. To which I answered that Swing is "all java" implementation and is light weight, as compared to AWT which uses peer components n all. He looked at me with that "Do u know what u are talking?" look, then I added that I am aware that few features like Drag n Drop require native code, but largely Swing is percieved as "all java", as it is written in documentation. To which he had "Nah!!" expression on his face.
Well, there was one more question which popped up during our discussion abt IP, which I can't recall now, but we did discuss it in details, and at the end of it, he said that it was sth new to him (he basically was a very nice guy), and I was confident abt it coz I had worked on that concept (IP classes, CIDR etc) for quite sometime with Network admin of my present company, and I have written a small tool IP decoder using that stuff. I did confirm that after my interview with the Net admin, and I was right abt it. So...
Anyway, I think I'll send them a mail today and hope for the best. If it doesn't work out, probably sth better will come my way....
- Manish
p.s. John, I am taking your post with me, and read it before every interview. It's that helpful
Roseanne Zhang
Ranch Hand

Joined: Nov 14, 2000
Posts: 1953
Swing is based on AWT, without peers, it does not work. The things on the top of windows are pure Java. The new MAC OS X does even better and more depend on the native stuff, and work more efficient and prettier. Your interviewer's nah looking tells he knew that.
Roseanne Zhang
Ranch Hand

Joined: Nov 14, 2000
Posts: 1953
2-3 = -1
OR is an acronym for Operation Research, very popular on Wall St. now.
Both are true, but I'm just kidding
[ July 05, 2002: Message edited by: Roseanne Zhang ]
Sridhar Garimella
Ranch Hand

Joined: Feb 18, 2000
Posts: 73
Roseanne
I did not get this point
"Swing is based on AWT, without peers, it does not work. The things on the top of windows are pure Java".
Can you pls explain little bit more?
Thanks in advance
Sridhar Garimella


Thanks,<br />Sridhar.
Manish Hatwalne
Ranch Hand

Joined: Sep 22, 2001
Posts: 2578

Originally posted by Roseanne Zhang:
Swing is based on AWT, without peers, it does not work. The things on the top of windows are pure Java. The new MAC OS X does even better and more depend on the native stuff, and work more efficient and prettier. Your interviewer's nah looking tells he knew that.

No.
I agree that Swing is on top of AWT, the fact is that JComponent extends Container which in turn extends Component; so that's preety obvious. (I think, I drew this hierarchy there on paper). So Swing won't work without AWT - peers. BUT, swing itself is all Java (Besides, drang n drop and 2d graphics, so says java tutorial). Swing does ensure that UI look n feel is same (well, almost!!) on all platforms, unlike AWT which gives the native platform look n feel.
During the interview, I reacalled reading "all java" keyword somewhere w.r.t to Swing, and when I came home, I did verify it from Java API and Java tutorial. Here are they -
1) Java API doc - Provides a set of "lightweight" (all-Java language) components that, to the maximum degree possible, work the same on all platforms.
2) Swing Tutorial - The biggest difference between the AWT components and Swing components is that the Swing components are implemented with absolutely no native code. Since Swing components aren't restricted to the least common denominator -- the features that are present on every platform ...
And Ithink my answer almost conveyed same content then.
Regarding Mac, I am really clueless, would love to have a look at it though...
And I doubt if my interviewers knew that, coz they mentioned that since they didn't know Swing well, they won't be asking much abt it.
Anyway, forget it!!!
Like you guys told me, there are always better options coming up. The good news is - I got another call today. I wrote two best technical tests one could ever get. Those guys know their stuff, tough but very interesting test papers. I passed first and they asked me write second, and they will get back to me in a week's time. So, there's some hope here....
- Manish
Manish Hatwalne
Ranch Hand

Joined: Sep 22, 2001
Posts: 2578

Originally posted by Roseanne Zhang:
2-3 = -1
OR is an acronym for Operation Research, very popular on Wall St. now.
Both are true, but I'm just kidding
[ July 05, 2002: Message edited by: Roseanne Zhang ]

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm
I guess, I'll revert back to 2/3. But promise me that you'll take it as - 2 or 3.
- Manish
Roseanne Zhang
Ranch Hand

Joined: Nov 14, 2000
Posts: 1953
Attention sreedhar and Manish:

Linked from Sun's Swing Tutorial, Mixing Heavy and Light Components

one of the primary design goals for Swing was that it be based on AWT architecture.
...

Read Graphic Java Master the JFC, 3rd edition, by David M. Geary p6
Nearly all Swing componenets are lightweight. The only exceptions are Swing's top-level containers: frames, applets, windows, and dialogs. Because lightweight components are rendered in their container's window instead of a window of their own, lightweights must ultimately be contained in a heavy weight container...

Also, on some Unix systems without GUI support, Swing will not work since the OS does not provide the native peers. Of course, it will work on these Unix system such as X-windows, Linux, Mac OS X, and ...
Unless, you want to do a lot of extra work (such as an emulator), then that should credit to you, not Swing any more...
[ July 06, 2002: Message edited by: Roseanne Zhang ]
Roseanne Zhang
Ranch Hand

Joined: Nov 14, 2000
Posts: 1953
Read the fine prints and read between lines, please! I'm serious!
People tends to read what they like or they think to read. Sun actually prefers you read that way too. Swing is not a good GUI product, it never was, and it will never be. Sorry to tell the truth. I'm ready to get a framing war against me or my statement. Just feel free to do so!
I'll not fight back!
[ July 06, 2002: Message edited by: Roseanne Zhang ]
Roseanne Zhang
Ranch Hand

Joined: Nov 14, 2000
Posts: 1953
Creative writer
Once I was writing a document for our new security system. After I put all the goodies, I put a section of limitations. They were deleted by proofreading process. I needed to be honest and also needed to avoid liability problems in the future. Finally, I figured out a way to pass the proofreading. I added a line: "The new system improved the security substantially." which actually should be read "The new system is better, but still has limitations." The proofreader actually laughed and said "You found a diplomatic way to say that!"
Do you see any similarity from the following quotes?
Originally posted by Manish Hatwalne:

1) Java API doc - Provides a set of "lightweight" (all-Java language) components that, to the maximum degree possible , work the same on all platforms.

My translation:
1) a set of : Not all of them
2) to the maximum degree possible : something is impossible
[ July 06, 2002: Message edited by: Roseanne Zhang ]
johanel mander
Greenhorn

Joined: Mar 17, 2011
Posts: 1
Hi

You can find this info by using search box in the top of website with some keywords related before posting questions.
Jan de Boer
Ranch Hand

Joined: Dec 10, 2010
Posts: 355
Hey, depending on the interviewer, the fact that you got the answer right or wrong might be totally irrelevant

If you got a manager and a human resources girl asking the questions. Probably they don't know even what they are asking. They look at things like, can he explain something well, does he get frustrated if someone else does not understand him, and has he got 'vibes'. No not being radioactive, but that is management talk about, looking happy enthusiastic, and being professionally dressed.

We can of course discuss about how imported the above properties really are to a computer software engineer, but the thing is, the people who at least partly decide if you get the job, think they are very important. Unfortunately sometimes even more then whether or not you got the answer right.

Henry Wong
author
Sheriff

Joined: Sep 28, 2004
Posts: 18710
    
  40


Please be careful here, as this topic dates back to 2002 !!

There's nothing wrong with continuing the conversation, just take a quick look to make sure that you are involved with the current part of the topic. Answering someone who is unlikely to answer may not be very productive.

Henry


Books: Java Threads, 3rd Edition, Jini in a Nutshell, and Java Gems (contributor)
 
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subject: Post interview follow up