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HCL or Sapient

Sharma Anjali
Ranch Hand

Joined: Feb 22, 2005
Posts: 63
I have an offer from HCL(Noida) and Sapient(Gurgaon). Both are offering almost a similar package 3.3L pa.
I am really confused which one to go for.
None of the 2 companies have told me which project I'll be working on.
I have the following obserations about both of them

Sapient
1. They definetely looked more professional and organized. Every thing was in place when I went for the interview, no chaos, interviewers were very friendly. They seem to have a very nice working environment.
2. Sapient is known to make you work in different phases of a lifecycle in different technologies. Although working in different phases looks good, I am not too sure about working in different technologies. The interviewer clearly told we can put you in any technology we want. I have a friend there who started with Java, moved to dot net, then datawarehousing and now in testing. Some people say that this is good in long run as you get a feel of all the technologies but others say you become jack of all and master of none and it becomes very hard to find a job outside sapient. Most companies want people with a particular no. of yrs in a particular technolgy rather than in different technologies. May be some experienced ranchers can tell which way one should take. I have 2 year of Java/J2EE exp.
3. Sapient is known for its hire and fire policy. They did that in the past in the US. Didn't have to till now in India as work has been good.
4. Sapient is known to implement some huge projects in size and in complexity.

HCL
1. Didn't look very professional but were reasonably OK.
2. I have 2 Years of J2EE experience so I'll be working in Java/J2EE
3. Job seems to be stable comparatively.
4. Don't know what sort of project they have and what I'll be put into.

Please help me by adding your observations or giving your suggesstions in this regard and help make a decision as ot which company to choose. I am really concerened about the second point above.

Thanks
[ August 08, 2005: Message edited by: Sharma Anjali ]
Rajul King
Ranch Hand

Joined: Apr 12, 2001
Posts: 47
Read some other posts in this group. HCL is a very rude company and you may be stressed while working there. Think in those lines, you make money for these companies. Any company that does not have one of its values as RESPECT, is not worth investing your entire career in.

Go ahead and choose SAPIENT and settle down for next 2-3 years. A company with bad name and with a reputation of hiring rude people may become your worst nightmare when you go look for another job down the line.
Victor Banerjee
Ranch Hand

Joined: May 30, 2005
Posts: 88
Originally posted by Sharma Anjali:
I have an offer from HCL(Noida) and Sapient(Gurgaon). Both are offering almost a similar package 3.3L pa.
I am really confused which one to go for.
None of the 2 companies have told me which project I'll be working on.
I have the following obserations about both of them
[ August 08, 2005: Message edited by: Sharma Anjali ]



Dont mind but you seem to be getting a lot of offers these days. Any special charm you are using ?
Sharma Anjali
Ranch Hand

Joined: Feb 22, 2005
Posts: 63
Originally posted by Victor Banerjee:



Dont mind but you seem to be getting a lot of offers these days. Any special charm you are using ?



Looks like companies need a lot of people these days
BTW any input on the above post.
Sachin Mehra
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jan 07, 2005
Posts: 77
One of my friends works for Sapient and he really puts in long hours...more than 70 hours per week ...so in case you are ready to put in such long hours....go for Sapient.
Pradeep bhatt
Ranch Hand

Joined: Feb 27, 2002
Posts: 8904

Originally posted by Sachin Mehra:
One of my friends works for Sapient and he really puts in long hours...more than 70 hours per week ...so in case you are ready to put in such long hours....go for Sapient.


I know 2 people who joined Sapient and quit within a week. One of collegue quit and joined Sapient. Next week he quit from Sapient. I am yet to talk to him.


Groovy
Kj Reddy
Ranch Hand

Joined: Sep 20, 2003
Posts: 1704
I vote for HCL. HCL is more stable then Sapient. We need stability. And more over HCL is a big company working in different domains. So probably you can try to jump into Banking as you are interested. Some posts saying HCL HR is rude but you will find those rude people here and there. Once you assigned to a project you may not much dpend on HR people.
Sharma Anjali
Ranch Hand

Joined: Feb 22, 2005
Posts: 63
Originally posted by KJ Reddy:
I vote for HCL. HCL is more stable then Sapient. We need stability. And more over HCL is a big company working in different domains. So probably you can try to jump into Banking as you are interested. Some posts saying HCL HR is rude but you will find those rude people here and there. Once you assigned to a project you may not much dpend on HR people.


Thanks everyone for replying. You are right rude people are everywhere.
HCL is giving me ECMP (Enterprise Content Management Portal) Group in Gurgaon.
Any idea about this group.
Sharma Anjali
Ranch Hand

Joined: Feb 22, 2005
Posts: 63
Any more comments please
Kj Reddy
Ranch Hand

Joined: Sep 20, 2003
Posts: 1704
Originally posted by Sharma Anjali:
Any more comments please


Make sure that you will get java related work and wont get just HTML and Javascript work in Enterprise Content Management Portal
Sharma Anjali
Ranch Hand

Joined: Feb 22, 2005
Posts: 63
Originally posted by KJ Reddy:


Make sure that you will get java related work and wont get just HTML and Javascript work in Enterprise Content Management Portal


No way to find that out. They don't tell what work they'll give before one joins. Infact they don't even tell the project one will work on
Kj Reddy
Ranch Hand

Joined: Sep 20, 2003
Posts: 1704
Originally posted by Sharma Anjali:


No way to find that out. They don't tell what work they'll give before one joins. Infact they don't even tell the project one will work on


Try to get the information fro people who are working in HCL. Ask them what kind of projects are done that specific group.

Other thing you can do is just tell to the HR that you would like to talk with Project Manager with whom you are going to work and you can ask him. But many companies may not allow that. I talked with my all Project Managers wherever I joined.
ab parashar
Ranch Hand

Joined: Mar 28, 2005
Posts: 130
Sapient will expose you to the American way of working. Slogging it out and having fun at the same time.Job security will be low, if the market tanks.

HCL will introduce you the Indian way of working :-)
That means that you cannot ask questions,you cannot make suggestions ,you cannot think out of the box.Your teachers at school will be replaced by the leads and the PMs,even if it means copy-pasting code rather than writing a function.

Job security will be high (no matter what the market)..I know people who have worked there for more than ten years.That can also mean stagnation for some.

Technically I think , both are the same, though at Sapient you would be exposed to different types of technologies.Also Sapient will give you an oppertunity to enhance your presentation skills....something thats not valued at HCL.
Victor Banerjee
Ranch Hand

Joined: May 30, 2005
Posts: 88
Originally posted by Sharma Anjali:



Looks like companies need a lot of people these days
BTW any input on the above post.


Go for Sapient. It would do good to your career in the long term.
Sharma Anjali
Ranch Hand

Joined: Feb 22, 2005
Posts: 63
Originally posted by Victor Banerjee:


Go for Sapient. It would do good to your career in the long term.


Thanks for replying.
Any particular reason for this.
Victor Banerjee
Ranch Hand

Joined: May 30, 2005
Posts: 88
Reasons are ample. And they are clearly highlghted in your posts. Sapient treats its employees as assets. HCL treats them as employee id.

Multiple technology exposure adds value to your portfolio and makes you more wanted.

Paywise Sapient has been good. And they have frequent increments as well. Their onsite pay is also pretty good.
Sachin Mehra
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jan 07, 2005
Posts: 77
Sapient is kinda company where either people really like it or don't like it at all.

Rule of the thumb: If you are not too worried about your life beyond work, go with Sapient
ab parashar
Ranch Hand

Joined: Mar 28, 2005
Posts: 130
Originally posted by Sachin Mehra:
Sapient is kinda company where either people really like it or don't like it at all.

Rule of the thumb: If you are not too worried about your life beyond work, go with Sapient


Rule of the thumb: If you want only work,no life(not even a chance to worry about it) go with HCL ggn.
Prem Khan
Ranch Hand

Joined: May 30, 2005
Posts: 189
Sharma, I guess it depends whether you like corporate stucture or not. Thats just personal choise. But what job pays better ?
Sharma Anjali
Ranch Hand

Joined: Feb 22, 2005
Posts: 63
Originally posted by Shawn DeSarkar:
Sharma, I guess it depends whether you like corporate stucture or not. Thats just personal choise. But what job pays better ?


They pay exactly the same.
nithin nambiar
Ranch Hand

Joined: Aug 11, 2005
Posts: 31
i have replied to a smilar query posted some time ago.
i have been in sapient for arnd 2 years before.
if you are a person who got good communication skills and like MNC work culture,then probably sapient is the company for you.
it is probably a place where people work hard and party harder.
in most of the cases you will always end up working weekends apart from long working hours,but at the same time get an opprotunity work with best in the industry.
you get lot of challenging work and you have to be on your toes always.
if you are looking for more technology related or more relaxed type of work then u shudn't take up sapient offer.
Sharma Anjali
Ranch Hand

Joined: Feb 22, 2005
Posts: 63
Thanks a lot everyone for replying.
Ranchers have always been extremely helpful
nithin nambiar
Ranch Hand

Joined: Aug 11, 2005
Posts: 31
so what did u decide ?
Sharma Anjali
Ranch Hand

Joined: Feb 22, 2005
Posts: 63
Originally posted by nithin nambiar:
so what did u decide ?


still confused
Actually I have not been able to find any information about ECMP(Enterprise Content Management and Potals) group in HCL where I'll be posted. Once I get some information about this group I'll be able to decide something.

Thanks
Siddhartha Sharma
Greenhorn

Joined: Aug 11, 2005
Posts: 11
Originally posted by Sharma Anjali:


still confused
Actually I have not been able to find any information about ECMP(Enterprise Content Management and Potals) group in HCL where I'll be posted. Once I get some information about this group I'll be able to decide something.

Thanks

I work with infosys Techn and here is my take :

In my opinion, you should join Sapient if salary you are getting is good.

Reason 1 : as far as i have heard, they take up high end work

Reason 2 : See work life balance in any company is a misnomer..It varies from case to case. Its pure luck .

Reason 3 : Used to be a dream company for IIMA grads back in 2000

Reason 4 : Exposure to multiple technologies is good in the long run..provied u r not changing technologies every 4-5 months

Reason 5 : You will get exposure to MNC culture

another important thing you should find out is

About Onsite Opportunities @ Sapient ??
Can anyone throw some light on this ??
Sharma Anjali
Ranch Hand

Joined: Feb 22, 2005
Posts: 63
Originally posted by Siddhartha Siddhartha:


About Onsite Opportunities @ Sapient ??
Can anyone throw some light on this ??


Thanks for your input.
As far as I know they don't send a person onsite before 1 year. Earlier the the min time one needed to stay in the company before one became eligible to go onsite was 6 months but recently they changed the peroid to 1 year.
Siddhartha Sharma
Greenhorn

Joined: Aug 11, 2005
Posts: 11
Originally posted by Sharma Anjali:


Thanks for your input.
As far as I know they don't send a person onsite before 1 year. Earlier the the min time one needed to stay in the company before one became eligible to go onsite was 6 months but recently they changed the peroid to 1 year.


May be Mr. Nithin Nambiar could throw more light on ONSITE pportunities(as i gather he has been working with sapient for two years )
nithin nambiar
Ranch Hand

Joined: Aug 11, 2005
Posts: 31
thatz true.
you dont generally get onsite opportunites within a yr of joining ,unless there is really some urgent requirement. in these cases they send u on a business visa.
onsite opprts depends on the kind of project you are working on and also a bit of luck is required. there are lot of people who have got arnd 3 opprtns in a year and also some people who havent got any in 3 years.
there are good number of IIM-A and IIT graduate's working there ,so you will learn a lot interacting with them.it suites people who are very young and unmarried who doesn't have to think annything aprt from work.
also pace of work is very hectic and lot of people find themselves lost.

hope this will help u eliminate ur confusion .
Sharma Anjali
Ranch Hand

Joined: Feb 22, 2005
Posts: 63
Originally posted by nithin nambiar:
thatz true.
you dont generally get onsite opportunites within a yr of joining ,unless there is really some urgent requirement. in these cases they send u on a business visa.
onsite opprts depends on the kind of project you are working on and also a bit of luck is required. there are lot of people who have got arnd 3 opprtns in a year and also some people who havent got any in 3 years.
there are good number of IIM-A and IIT graduate's working there ,so you will learn a lot interacting with them.it suites people who are very young and unmarried who doesn't have to think annything aprt from work.
also pace of work is very hectic and lot of people find themselves lost.

hope this will help u eliminate ur confusion .


Thanks a lot. Your input has been extremely useful.
Siddhartha Sharma
Greenhorn

Joined: Aug 11, 2005
Posts: 11
Originally posted by nithin nambiar:
thatz true.
you dont generally get onsite opportunites within a yr of joining ,unless there is really some urgent requirement. in these cases they send u on a business visa.
onsite opprts depends on the kind of project you are working on and also a bit of luck is required. there are lot of people who have got arnd 3 opprtns in a year and also some people who havent got any in 3 years.
there are good number of IIM-A and IIT graduate's working there ,so you will learn a lot interacting with them.it suites people who are very young and unmarried who doesn't have to think annything aprt from work.
also pace of work is very hectic and lot of people find themselves lost.

hope this will help u eliminate ur confusion .


From what I have heard about sapient in this BB, i think i want to join Sapient.

I suppose just like ONSITE , work life balance will again be on how lucky / unlucky you are ..dependign on your project you get allocated to.

Actually i happen to have an offer from Oracle Hydbad, Tavant Tech Bangaloare and Sapient Bangalore

Even at Infy(a so called human company) in my particular project, i have come to office every single day for 4 months at a stretch one and for 2 months at stretch at one another time .Every day was about 16 hours long..

and all this in one year ...
Vineet Banerjee
Greenhorn

Joined: Aug 22, 2005
Posts: 9
Has anyone here worked with Sapient as Senior Associate Technology L1. What is the kind of work offered to them? To continue the discussion which is better Mindtree or Sapient ? I have a offer from both of them
nithin nambiar
Ranch Hand

Joined: Aug 11, 2005
Posts: 31
people with this title are expected to lead a track(module) within the project.
they will b responsible for the performance of the track.
they are expected do all the planning & tracking activities of the track.
being a track lead in sapient is not a easy job at all,as it involves lot of man management skills and good communications skills.

but it is not necessary that all sr associates will get to play the role of track lead. it depends on the project and your sapient experience.
Victor Banerjee
Ranch Hand

Joined: May 30, 2005
Posts: 88
Originally posted by Vineet Banerjee:
Has anyone here worked with Sapient as Senior Associate Technology L1. What is the kind of work offered to them? To continue the discussion which is better Mindtree or Sapient ? I have a offer from both of them


Hey Vineet, How many years of experience do you have and what is your profile ? Based on that I should be able to answer something.
Vineet Banerjee
Greenhorn

Joined: Aug 22, 2005
Posts: 9
I have 5 yrs of exp in J2EE, UML etc does this info help you Victor
Vineet Banerjee
Greenhorn

Joined: Aug 22, 2005
Posts: 9
Does it involve user interaction, analysis, designing and coding also
Victor Banerjee
Ranch Hand

Joined: May 30, 2005
Posts: 88
Originally posted by Vineet Banerjee:
I have 5 yrs of exp in J2EE, UML etc does this info help you Victor


What Nitin says above about SAL1 in Sapient is correct. You play the role of a kind of Team Lead. And as countless people have been saying the focus in Sapient is on Presentation skills along with technical skills. Mindtree has been for a pretty long time but not grown as well as it seemed to be growing something back. Considering the IT boom, it does not seem to have capitalized much on it. Sapient has grown really fast and figures in most IT company reviews in the top 10 especially in People practices.

Hope this helps.
Vineet Banerjee
Greenhorn

Joined: Aug 22, 2005
Posts: 9
Mindtree has been for a pretty long time but not grown as well as it seemed to be growing something back.

Thank you Victor for your input, but on the contrary what i heard was they are planning to be a 100 million company this year and go for an IPO next year. In any case, looks like Sapient is a better choice at this point considering the wide exposure they provide if i am not wrong in assessing the discussion
Vineet Banerjee
Greenhorn

Joined: Aug 22, 2005
Posts: 9
Nitin, do you have an idea of the salary that Sapient pays at the level of SA L1 ?
nithin nambiar
Ranch Hand

Joined: Aug 11, 2005
Posts: 31
Salary is not fixed for a particular title in sapient.
it depends on ur performance in ur interview and also how much ur able to bargain.
Range for a SAL1 is between 6 & 8.
Vineet Banerjee
Greenhorn

Joined: Aug 22, 2005
Posts: 9
Thank you Nithin. Anybody else has any idea on the Mindtree vs Sapient issue
 
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