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(MS).Net vs (??)Java

Shri Rohit Kumar
Greenhorn

Joined: Apr 27, 2006
Posts: 11
Greetings there,

With the knowledge that java has been open sourced,i was wondering(late though) that given .Net as its foremost competetor, the fact that java is open sourced, does it make a customer/client to opt for .Net over Java, as they have someone(MS) to take to task if things go wrong, but that is not the case with java now.

So i was full of doubts with these questions:

1) Will this development bring a shift of projects from Java to .Net??
2) How intelligent is the customer/client to understand the benefits of open source?
3) What is SUN gonna do,it has started opening source for not only Java SE but also Java EE and even Jini and what not,including solaris.
4) Should a fresh java developer start to worry?

Comments anyone?

thanks,
rohit.


Namaste, i honour the spirit in you which is also in me.
Deepak Bala
Bartender

Joined: Feb 24, 2006
Posts: 6662
    
    5

1) Will this development bring a shift of projects from Java to .Net??


Naah !

2) How intelligent is the customer/client to understand the benefits of open source?


Clients know very little about whats going on within the project ( usually ). Its up to the marketing team to feed them with stuff like this.

3) What is SUN gonna do,it has started opening source for not only Java SE but also Java EE and even Jini and what not,including solaris.


Their strategy here is to develop better products through open sourcing (supposedly). Thats what I hear. They think its a good defense against dot net.


4) Should a fresh java developer start to worry?


Naah ! Java will stay for a couple of years atleast the way i see it. Even if they do begin to shift to something else there will still be projects that are maintained in java. Phasing out java will take a lot of time considering the number of applications that run on java around the world.


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Srikanth Raghavan
Ranch Hand

Joined: Oct 31, 2005
Posts: 389
Well, I am not an expert, but this is one topic I love to debate and had done it whenever possible.

Java has almost became indispensable, like Cobol. There is so much code that is already written in Java which have to be maintained for a very long period. And believe me, our clients do most of their new development in Java to make sure they are platform independent (well most of the code base) and their motive is to sell as many copies as possible, which is possible if written in Java. That means, unlike Cobol (I think), people are still writing and will continue to write new code in Java.

And unlike .NET, Java has a bigger community and unlike .NET there are so many companies other than Sun who have contributed to Java and who will continue to contribute to Java in the years to come. To name a company, take the big blues, IBM. In my opinion, IBM has played a major role and has extracted more out of Java than anyone perhaps. To my knowledge, most of the IBM platforms support Java. I know for sure that AS400 (or iSeries 400 or whatever they named it today) supports Java.

So in that regard, god forbid, even if Sun shuts down tomorrow, Java will not go down. In fact, because it has been Open Sourced the dependency on Sun has gone down significantly and will continue to grow independent of Sun.

And besides that, there are so many outside supports who have a great deal of interest in Java and that I am 99% sure that Java is here to stay till I retire (I am just 1+ experienced), exactly like how Cobol is now.

It is not the red hot technology of 2007, perhaps AJAX is, but Java is here to stay for a very, very, very long time. And porting all those legacy apps isn't a small thing like moving your knight in a chess board.

And regarding your questions, I think John explained it better that what I could have.

Hope this helps, happy coding Java!
-- Srikanth
[ January 04, 2007: Message edited by: Srikanth Raghavan ]
Rohit Nath
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jun 16, 2006
Posts: 387
Java will stay for a couple of years atleast

That's bit of an understatement.
Long live JAVA!

ho. la la la..ho....!


R.N
Shri Rohit Kumar
Greenhorn

Joined: Apr 27, 2006
Posts: 11
Greetings there,

So what all i can gather:

1)It's upto marketing people to decide what technology devels of a company work on!? .I thought marketing folks depend on their tech parts for directions. Is this the general trend or depends on a company...

2)Is SUN's only objective is to post strong resistence against .NET? As far as i understand, till date SUN has everything from hardware to OS to java platform to debuggers in their workshop, that not many(no-one, i guess) have.So defending against .NET sounds not like SUN!

3)So i am convinced that java is going to be here and getting on new code will solely depend on the environment on is working in.So that sounds good!

Also i'd like to know a rough estimate of projects done on java for the desktop/web not mobile.

Long Live JaVa :-)

regards,
rohit.
Rohit Nath
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jun 16, 2006
Posts: 387
1)It's upto marketing people to decide what technology devels of a company work on!? .I thought marketing folks depend on their tech parts for directions. Is this the general trend or depends on a company...

No! It doesnot work that way..

When product/solution is being proposed following things are taken into consideration:-
1. Which technology best solves the problem on hand?
2. Is the technology marketable? (Here itself marketability of product is taken care of)
3. Is the technology scalable/portable and other "..ables" this also helps in marketing the product

A lot of market study and domain analysis is done before actually undertaking actual development of any product.
Based on this initiall crucial decisions the product/service is developed.
The marketing team then comes in to use these advantages to sell the product to its prospective clients/customers.

Market Analysis-> (decide technology) -> develop product -> Marketing team -> Clients/Customers

So Marketing team's job is to sell the product on hand.It has got very little to do with deciding the technical aspects of the product.

You can think of it as two seperate entities:
1. Development team: Undertakes lifecycle of product.
2. Marketing team: Markets the product to prospective clients.

One important point to note here.
A good marketing team can sell ice from Antarctica to eskimos at price of Gold! (This is no exhageration believe me!)
Anjali S Sharma
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jun 29, 2005
Posts: 279
Originally posted by Srikanth Raghavan:

It is not the red hot technology of 2007, perhaps AJAX is

[ January 04, 2007: Message edited by: Srikanth Raghavan ]


BTW, AJAX is not a technology
Srikanth Raghavan
Ranch Hand

Joined: Oct 31, 2005
Posts: 389
Originally posted by Anjali S Sharma:


BTW, AJAX is not a technology


OK, Ajax may not be a technology, and I don't know what exactly it is. So, Can you define it then?
Eric Pascarello
author
Rancher

Joined: Nov 08, 2001
Posts: 15376
    
    6
Originally posted by Rohit Nath:

No! It doesnot work that way..

When product/solution is being proposed following things are taken into consideration:-
1. Which technology best solves the problem on hand?
2. Is the technology marketable? (Here itself marketability of product is taken care of)
3. Is the technology scalable/portable and other "..ables" this also helps in marketing the product

A lot of market study and domain analysis is done before actually undertaking actual development of any product.
Based on this initiall crucial decisions the product/service is developed.
The marketing team then comes in to use these advantages to sell the product to its prospective clients/customers.

Market Analysis-> (decide technology) -> develop product -> Marketing team -> Clients/Customers

So Marketing team's job is to sell the product on hand.It has got very little to do with deciding the technical aspects of the product.

You can think of it as two seperate entities:
1. Development team: Undertakes lifecycle of product.
2. Marketing team: Markets the product to prospective clients.

One important point to note here.
A good marketing team can sell ice from Antarctica to eskimos at price of Gold! (This is no exhageration believe me!)


Most of the stuff you said there is in a DREAM WORLD. A lot of companies live on buzz words and do not look at at a technology before they use it. I know in my short career it is the case most of the time.

I been doing plenty of Ajax work and Web 2.0 stuff as side jobs because their boss's heard the buzz. My first job I had to rewrite all of their apps from different languages to VB.NET because the boss heard that .NET was the next biggest thing and he wanted to be hip. He has no clue of the impact, nor did the business.

A lot of companies will go blindly into the world of .Net, Java, PHP, etc without evaluating it. Other companies have a mindset and will not change.

Got to love the world of management!

Eric
Deepak Bala
Bartender

Joined: Feb 24, 2006
Posts: 6662
    
    5

Got to love the world of management!


hehehe ! Tell me about it ! I have seen better sometimes though.
 
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