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Help wanted for keeping my job

loknath shesgiri
Greenhorn

Joined: Jan 03, 2008
Posts: 3
Hi, I chose this forum to ask cause teachers are the best who can answer this .



  • Q: I'm a non IT guy , just finished my studies, Got a development job , i have been put into live project for webdevelopment!!! (website creation). Its been 3 months now into project and i'm feeling very difficult to understand . First thing is I don't have good knowledge of java nor its advanced topics like struts, I can understand the program written but i can never know the flow, what is calling what method, what will then happend.. I am not getting the flow of website developing .I can't change my Job also.Here i don't have much helping or guiding mates, So no question of asking for help. I tried but none have time or intrest? I have faced humiliating moments cause i don't know the things to do the job.



    I'm trying to do my level best but i cannot do it with pace of others. I'm a slow learner, I don't understand the things seeing scraps and bits in google. I tried Various books for struts (cause its the main thing for our project) but could not understand much. Now i want to start from scratch , go level by level. Starting from first, From the very basic java program to the advanced level eg struts and J2ee(I even don't know how advanced they are!!)

    If you want to rate myself for the subject , here it is, so you can know my level
    Java 20%
    J2ee 10%
    Struts 30%( 3 month study still way back)
    JSP 30%
    html 40%

    Can you please help me though the ways i can learn from first ? I promise to work hard as guided by you all along with doing my work Thanks in advance , I hope you will all guide me through the problem For any suggestion privately my email is [edited e-mail]

    [please use the forum, not e-mail for questions]
    [ January 03, 2008: Message edited by: Jeanne Boyarsky ]
    Pauline McNamara
    Sheriff

    Joined: Jan 19, 2001
    Posts: 4012
        
        6
    Hi "google guy", welcome to Javaranch.

    We don't have too many rules around here, but one that we take very seriously is the naming policy. Please take a minute to change your display name to your real name so it complies with the naming policy.

    Thanks!
    Pauline
    loknath shesgiri
    Greenhorn

    Joined: Jan 03, 2008
    Posts: 3
    Now would you reply sir.
    i have taken a risk too as most of my team mates will be on this site for something or other.
    If they read it it will really give them a hint. But i don't want to do that. you are getting my point right sir

    I 'm hoping for guidance thats all and i do hope will all due respect you'll guide me.
    Ernest Friedman-Hill
    author and iconoclast
    Marshal

    Joined: Jul 08, 2003
    Posts: 24168
        
      30

    I'm not trying to be rude, but Pauline linked directly to our naming policy as part of her request. This document begins (emphasis mine


    All JavaRanch users are asked to use a real name as their display name, with a first and last name, and maybe more, separated by spaces.


    The name you've chosen ("loknath") doesn't meet this criterion, because it's just a single name.

    Now, I'm not trying to make too big an issue out of this, but if this is the way you normally follow instructions, then that's going to be part of your problem right there. Being detail-oriented is an important part of doing development work, and you're going to have to learn to pay better attention to details.

    Further, note that you're posting this in the forum we reserve for discussing how to teach -- and this is not at all the topic of your post. Again, a lack of attention to detail, I'm afraid. We have a forum entitled "Jobs Discussion" which would be far more appropriate; I'll move this thread there.

    Finally, my own opinion is that you won't find too much sympathy there. The job market is tight all over; taking a job for which you're not qualified -- presumably under false pretenses -- won't win you many friends.
    [ January 05, 2008: Message edited by: Ernest Friedman-Hill ]

    [Jess in Action][AskingGoodQuestions]
    loknath shesgiri
    Greenhorn

    Joined: Jan 03, 2008
    Posts: 3
    Thanks Ernest Friedman-Hill ,
    How am i gonna improve myself now?
    Choosing a different job is not an option, but i can surely try hard to get the required skills to be doing what i have been given?

    I just want to know where to start(java basics , which i have already started) once i do get it , what next to learn for my current web development field ?
    Srikanth Basa
    Ranch Hand

    Joined: Jun 06, 2005
    Posts: 241
    Loknath, I understand your situation because most of us have been through these kind of situations at some time or the other. To keep your morale up, you have to understand that if something goes wrong in the project, the project manager is more responsible rather than the developer. So, keep your cool !

    I'm afraid, your project manager hasn't been monitoring how you have been doing in the past 3 months (and that too when you are straight out of college ! ) I definitely don't expect a fresher to be able to develop/fix code independently.

    Writing code and at a good pace comes with practise, experience and time and you are armed with none of these right now. Even if you work very hard, 3 months is a long duration and I don't think you can compensate and fill in for those lost hours by sheer hard work.

    What I suggest is, speak to your project manager and say that you cannot complete the task on your own and request for some assistance from a senior member of the team. Yeah, you are bound to face some negative reactions from the management but atleast intimating before hand would help your you in choosing the better option out of the bad and the worst options. Again remember, these things are common and do occur in most of the work places so don't leave all your hope and relax
    Andrew Monkhouse
    author and jackaroo
    Marshal Commander

    Joined: Mar 28, 2003
    Posts: 11284
        
      59

    Loknath,

    You may be interested in looking at the JavaRanch Cattle Drive. This will give you more experience writing Java code (and there is an entire section on Servlets (web development with Java - this will give you a more fundamental view of how J2EE development works. Struts sits on top of Servlets)). And there are some fantastic volunteers who work with the Cattle Drive to look at your code and suggest ways of improving it.
    i have taken a risk too as most of my team mates will be on this site for something or other.
    If you are really worried about this, then you could change your display name to some real sounding name that is not your own. The naming policy explicitly allows the display name to be "a name that at least looks like it could belong to a real person".
    If they read it it will really give them a hint.
    There are a number of potential possibilities I see here:
  • I hire a person as a "programmer" (no Struts requirements) and I see them here asking Struts questions.


  • In this case I would fully expect that person to be using any resources they could. and I don't care whether that means reading books (even at work), bugging other staff, or using online sites such as this one.

    (I'm even putting my money where my mouth is on this one: I have a programmer starting work for me on Monday who has not listed any Java skills on his resume. I expect him to have a ramp-up time just learning the fundamentals.)

  • I hire a person as a junior Struts programmer (so they stated that they used Struts in an existing project several years ago), and I see them here asking Struts questions.


  • Some questions could be reasonable, especially if they were asking about some feature that came out in a recent version of Struts. Or asking about how to use some feature that might not have been used in some other project (e.g. adding security).

  • I hire a person as a senior Struts programmer because they stated that they have a high level of experience, and they ask the most basic questions (e.g. "can someone give me the simplest Struts application for me to look at").


  • I think in this case that I would be justifiably upset in this case. (I would also be upset at myself for not having verified this during the interviews).So if you fit into the first 2 categories, then there should be no problems with them seeing you ask questions here under your real name.

    Regards, Andrew
    [ January 05, 2008: Message edited by: Andrew Monkhouse ]

    The Sun Certified Java Developer Exam with J2SE 5: paper version from Amazon, PDF from Apress, Online reference: Books 24x7 Personal blog
    Henry Wong
    author
    Sheriff

    Joined: Sep 28, 2004
    Posts: 18138
        
      39

    Here i don't have much helping or guiding mates, So no question of asking for help. I tried but none have time or intrest? I have faced humiliating moments cause i don't know the things to do the job.


    I find it amazing that none have time or interest to help a freshly minted graduate. I also find it amazing that they left you for 3 months with little supervision. I wouldn't worry too much about the humiliation part -- anyone that get kicks from humiliating a fresher is probably not very good either.

    But still, what kind of company/project would have developers with no experience, and let them roam free?

    Henry


    Books: Java Threads, 3rd Edition, Jini in a Nutshell, and Java Gems (contributor)
    arulk pillai
    Author
    Ranch Hand

    Joined: May 31, 2007
    Posts: 3216
    Why not have a chat with your technical/team leads to get some guidance or try to find some fellow developers who like to mentor. I strongly believe that mid to senior level developers can enhance their skills/knowledge by mentoring fellow/junior developers. It is up to your team leads/project manager to build that culture.


    Java Interview Questions and Answers Blog | Amazon.com profile | Java Interview Books
    Oggi Olli
    Ranch Hand

    Joined: Oct 11, 2007
    Posts: 83
    Originally posted by google guy:

    If you want to rate myself for the subject , here it is, so you can know my level
    Java 20%
    J2ee 10%
    Struts 30%( 3 month study still way back)
    JSP 30%
    html 40%


    My way of approaching this situation would be to get a really good knowledge of Java and OO basics. I'm fairly new as a developer as well (8 months) and I was also employed to a position where I needed to use those technologies. As I only knew Java on beforehand, I got a lot of help from my workmates, and eventually I reached a level where I'm comfortable with web development.

    To cite a blog I read the other day:

    Here's the deal: When you decide to learn something new, you have to accept that the first section of the learning curve requires a lot of effort, often without any significant perception of improvement. But if you struggle on, even while feeling like a wounded soldier in a Wilfred Owen poem, you will wake up one morning to realise that you actually improved a great deal.


    Finally I'd suggest reading a good introductory Java book for starters.
     
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