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Is it worth doing Java

raj koura
Greenhorn

Joined: Oct 10, 2000
Posts: 11
I plan to appear in Java certification test in January, 2001. I have been told by many people that it is not worth doing Java as it may lose its poularity soon.
They say that Visual Basic 7 is going to be its competitor.
please advise.
raj koura.

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Harpal Singh
Ranch Hand

Joined: Oct 10, 2000
Posts: 229
they also say world is going to end!!!
Harpal
asim wagan
Ranch Hand

Joined: Nov 14, 2000
Posts: 62
HI! I think java will persist the problem with VB7 is that it is not platform independant so don't worry about it. You can not java with VB. Java comes in the category of C+ type of languages. So, think this way that C++ is for individual systems and java is for networks.
Nijeesh Balan
Ranch Hand

Joined: Oct 09, 2000
Posts: 116
HI Guys,
Are there any chances of C# ( C Sharp), a Microsoft product overwhelming JAVA?

Nijeesh


Thanks & Regards,<br />Nijeesh.
Udayan Naik
Ranch Hand

Joined: Oct 18, 2000
Posts: 135
Well,Raj and Nijeesh,this is a wrong place to post these questions.NOBODY here is going to say 'YES', including me.
And personally,I dont think that *any* (MS) product is going to remotely challenge Java.
Java is the King Of The World !!!
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Udayan Naik<BR>Sun Certified Programmer for the Java 2 Platform
Shubhangi A. Patkar
Ranch Hand

Joined: Sep 20, 2000
Posts: 78
Udayan,
I tend to disagree, with you. This might not be the forum to post this question, but not the place?? Who better than us prove that Java rules?
Don't take me wrong, I fully agree with you on the fact that java is the greatest thing that happened to us, but let us be also realistic, there are places where some thing platform dependent like ms products work out much better. Let us be open, matter of fact about the issue and ack that some issues like this exist.
I think it is worth doing java because of the ease of net related and embedded kind of programming you will be able to do in java. That is where the world seems to be moving to. C# might be a strong contender, but given past experience, it might turn into another platform-dependant thing, again maybe not.
Right now, Java Rules, no questions about that.
Shubhangi.
Amit Roy
Ranch Hand

Joined: Oct 10, 2000
Posts: 132
*MICROSOFT PRODUCY REPLACING JAVA**
HAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!
thats all i can say. may b client side but never server side.
I also have heard that c# has no libraries of its own all taken from C++ and VB
AMIT
[This message has been edited by Amit Roy (edited November 15, 2000).]


<I>Chance Favours the Prepared minds"</I>
Danish Shaukat
Ranch Hand

Joined: Nov 16, 1999
Posts: 340
Hi all!
Java is the future !
Right now java provides best solutions for the server.J2EE platform is getting a lot of attention.
Moreover in future Java 2 Micro Edition is going to steal the show.
I feel that Java is really . And this place is full of Java fanatics.
Regards
Danish Shaukat
Marcus Green
arch rival
Rancher

Joined: Sep 14, 1999
Posts: 2813
C# may be a fine product and its designer is well known to be a very sharp guy. The language has had good reviews so far. However it will always be specific to the Microsoft platform.
Java has a 5 year lead and is supported by every significant software company on the planet (including a rather reluctant Microsoft). Never under-estimate the power of Bill Envy (though greed is pretty powerful as well).
The Microsoft Operating systems have a shrinking relative Market share for the first time in a long time (ever?). The Linux platform is hard to measure by the normal methods because most copies are not sold commercially, but even by that method it is set to become a very important player. .Net and C# are unlikely to be available for the Linux platform.
I am certain that C# and .NET will be successful, with the backing of Microsoft it would be amazing if it were not. However it's lack of cross platform availability and maturity will mean that Java has a much wider and deeper acceptance.
But perhaps this debate should be in another forum.
Marcus

SCWCD: Online Course, 50,000+ words and 200+ questions
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Ray Hsieh
Ranch Hand

Joined: Sep 20, 2000
Posts: 59
Hi Sahir,
Please elaborate on this statement: "Java is full of bugs and fundamental design flaws".
Any concrete examples? And in what way does C# rectify/prevent those bugs and flaws?
No offense, just want to know whether you really know what you're talking about or you're just talking nonsense--out of your blind enthusiasm about C#.
Cheers,
Ray.
Originally posted by Sahir Shah:

Raj Koura,
Frankly speaking, its not worth it. Java is full of bugs and fundamental design flaws. I would recommend taking the C# path.
C# is not like other Microsoft products, it is a totally
different breed. Simply for the reason that it has got Anders Hejlsberg behind it (the chief architect of Turbo Pascal and Delphi). It also depends on if Sun will be able to get its act together.
Cheers

Udayan Naik
Ranch Hand

Joined: Oct 18, 2000
Posts: 135
Shubhangi,i agree that there are some places where Java is not the best solution.But i disagree with ur view on platform specific issues.
In the first place,Java was desigend to give a cross-platform solution.So it is not in competition with products which give platform specific solutions.
Secondly,with the proper tuning and optimization,Java code can be compared in speed to any other platform specific code.
The Java language provides an environment to write cross-platform,error-free,robust and modular code.
The Java-Linux combination is really strong right now.
Not that C# will be a failure.It has to make a mark,being backed by MS.But I think Java will not be eclipsed by any C#.
Sahir,please tell us what 'fundamental design flaws' are present in Java and how C# has improved upon them.Bugs,well....yes,Java does have some bugs.But then no software that big and powerful and easy to use comes bug-free.What I am really anxious to know ,is C# bug-free or desiged better than Java?
I mean no offence to anybody.Please pardon me if i have hurt anybody's sentiments.
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Ajith Kallambella
Sheriff

Joined: Mar 17, 2000
Posts: 5782
Sorry guys, this discussion doesn't quite fit in to the certification forum. I am moving this thread to Meaningless Drivel where you can continue the contemplation
Ajith

Open Group Certified Distinguished IT Architect. Open Group Certified Master IT Architect. Sun Certified Architect (SCEA).
Paul Selby
Ranch Hand

Joined: Oct 20, 2000
Posts: 41
Just to throw one more into the circle.
Python? Is this meant to be an alternative to C, Java, et al.
I not sure it if it is even an OOP.
Frank Carver
Sheriff

Joined: Jan 07, 1999
Posts: 6920
Python is a good language. It's clean, Object-Oriented, powerful and works very well together with Java. See http://www.jpython.org . Python is also the implemntation language for ZOPE, an amazing web application/server/database.


Read about me at frankcarver.me ~ Raspberry Alpha Omega ~ Frank's Punchbarrel Blog
Cindy Glass
"The Hood"
Sheriff

Joined: Sep 29, 2000
Posts: 8521
You know, based on this thread I went and did some reading on c# - found the beginnings of a nice little tutorial. It sure looked like I was reading Java with a few bells and whistles thrown in. I gotta think that if you get a good grounding in Java, adding c# to your repertoire will be a piece of cake.
Of course cluttering my mind with one more set of variations on syntax and libraries seems tiring - especially when you get to pay MicroSoft for the opportunity. Eventually you have to BUY Visual Studio.NET to code c# in it. Sure is nice that Java is free to us poor programmers.
Peter Drayton had some cautions about space/time tradeoff in methods of compilation of DLLs in c# (see the readme.txt in his TestModules example)
Peter Drayton's .NET Goodies = http://www.razorsoft.net/
Found tutorial here http://www.csharp-station.com/
[This message has been edited by Cindy Glass (edited November 15, 2000).]


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Junaid Bhatra
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jun 27, 2000
Posts: 213
There are a couple of "enlightening" articles on C# and the .NET platform. Have a look at them and then decide for yourself! Sure Anders Hejlsberg is the architect behind C#, but don't forget that he is working for MS now and not Borland. I strongly believe that VB is the most disgusting language I have ever come across.
An analysis of .NET
Microsoft .NET vs J2EE
[This message has been edited by Junaid Bhatra (edited November 16, 2000).]
Ray Hsieh
Ranch Hand

Joined: Sep 20, 2000
Posts: 59
Wow wow, Sahir... relax! No need to turn blue over this
I was just wondering whether you knew something about the things you were saying... I don't need to blush because I didn't make any statement about C#
I won't make any comparison or statement between the two cos I know practically zilch about C#. But I know a bit about Java.. and since you made such a strong statement about it, I expected you to know a bit of both... and after reading your post, well maybe you do after all
Cheers,
Ray.

Originally posted by Sahir Shah:

Ray,
Take a look at this (its right next door)
http://www.javaranch.com/ubb/Forum24/HTML/005560.html
There is plenty more where that came from. All related to fundamental flaws in the language. Another notable one is the calling of polymethods in constructors problem. You show me a couple of such flaws (they must be fundamental language design flaws not bugs related to the misbehaviour of components/classes in the framework library ) in C# and it will be my turn to blush.
Cheers.
Sahir


[This message has been edited by Sahir Shah (edited November 15, 2000).]

Jon Noreika
Greenhorn

Joined: Dec 06, 2000
Posts: 5
For those still interested in Java v. C#, www.javaworld.com is currently providing a couple of articles comparing them. Part 2 is titled "C#: A language alternative or just J--?"
Anonymous
Ranch Hand

Joined: Nov 22, 2008
Posts: 18944
The jokes on you.
C# is already proven itself more powerful then Java. Yea Servlets and JSP is Ok, but a windows app in Java? VB is much faster. C# also allows you to use pointers when speed is critical as well as operator overloading. Bye, Bye Java
Greg Harris
Ranch Hand

Joined: Apr 12, 2001
Posts: 1012
no joke... who is this guy digging up a post from december??? and, if java is dead, then why is he on this forum?


what?
Ray Marsh
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jan 12, 2000
Posts: 458
C# is obviously M$ answer to Java. M$ will fight tooth and nail to kill and obliterate Java or any thing else that has the gall to challenge king Bill.
The whole .NET, C#, VB thing looks attractive, from a developers point-of-view.
The problem is... once you give in to the dark-side, forever will it dominate your destiny. You have to sell your soul to M$. They have a history of manipulation and control, whilst weaving an image of an innovative, progressive software company, which they are anything but.
See this thread... http://www.javaranch.com/ubb/Forum32/HTML/000367.html
Especially this article which Jane Griscti provided´┐Ż http://www.euronet.nl/users/frankvw/IhateMS.html

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