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Help Please! Java or What?

Sean Magee
Ranch Hand

Joined: Aug 23, 2004
Posts: 69
I do not mean to cross post, but I really need an answer on this so I posted here and in the beginners forum, and advanced just so I know it will get answered. Hello, I am new to these forums, and I am starting college at Tulane University in New Orleans. My major will be CIS (computer information systems) and I have question that I need answered. Since my knowledge on progarmming is not much at the moment, I hope that will change (and it will) shortly for I am very interested. Here is my question. In my major I have two paths I could decide on taking.

NUMBER ONE - One is Pascal, problem solving with pl/sql, Relation Databse Analysis and logical design relational databse physical design and implementation, and advanced courses using Oracle and other tools and strategies suitable to their needs.

Or

Number TWO - Intro to Java, Problem Solving With Java, Object Oriented ANalysis, logical design, Object Oriented Physical Design and implementation.

So for my future career in database development and other professions I could attain with the knowledge of either one of these "paths" which one do you guys think would be the most beneficial? Help is greatly appreciated
Stefan Wagner
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jun 02, 2003
Posts: 1923

You should crosspost it to JDBC too, and I'm sure, you may find additional places.


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Ko Ko Naing
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jun 08, 2002
Posts: 3178
Originally posted by Sean Magee:
NUMBER ONE - One is Pascal, problem solving with pl/sql, Relation Databse Analysis and logical design relational databse physical design and implementation, and advanced courses using Oracle and other tools and strategies suitable to their needs.

Or

Number TWO - Intro to Java, Problem Solving With Java, Object Oriented ANalysis, logical design, Object Oriented Physical Design and implementation.


I would go for option two... Pascal is not widely used in this age, I guess... But Oracle PL/SQL might be interesting as well...

But each of them goes for different career path: the first option is for DBA field or the second option is for Programmer Analyst field... It's also up to your interest...

Just my 2 cents...:0


Co-author of SCMAD Exam Guide, Author of JMADPlus
SCJP1.2, CCNA, SCWCD1.4, SCBCD1.3, SCMAD1.0, SCJA1.0, SCJP6.0
Nicholas Cheung
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Joined: Nov 07, 2003
Posts: 4982
It really depends on what is the trade-off of your system. Basically, if it is a database issue, I will consider to use PL-SQL, as the build in DB language will defintely give the better performance.

Of course, if the *Java* you mean is not Java application, but Java Store Procedures, I would say using Java is a better choice.

Nick


SCJP 1.2, OCP 9i DBA, SCWCD 1.3, SCJP 1.4 (SAI), SCJD 1.4, SCWCD 1.4 (Beta), ICED (IBM 287, IBM 484, IBM 486), SCMAD 1.0 (Beta), SCBCD 1.3, ICSD (IBM 288), ICDBA (IBM 700, IBM 701), SCDJWS, ICSD (IBM 348), OCP 10g DBA (Beta), SCJP 5.0 (Beta), SCJA 1.0 (Beta), MCP(70-270), SCBCD 5.0 (Beta), SCJP 6.0, SCEA for JEE5 (in progress)
Ko Ko Naing
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jun 08, 2002
Posts: 3178
Originally posted by Nicholas Cheung:
It really depends on what is the trade-off of your system. Basically, if it is a database issue, I will consider to use PL-SQL, as the build in DB language will defintely give the better performance.

Of course, if the *Java* you mean is not Java application, but Java Store Procedures, I would say using Java is a better choice.


Sean Magee, it's wise to believe Nick, since he is an expert both Oracle and Java stuffs... As for me, my java skill is surely better than my Oracle skill... That's one of the reason why I chose option two in your choice...
Nicholas Cheung
Ranch Hand

Joined: Nov 07, 2003
Posts: 4982
Ko Ko,

I guess you have a stronger Java background than me.

Nick
Ko Ko Naing
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jun 08, 2002
Posts: 3178
Originally posted by Nicholas Cheung:
Ko Ko,

I guess you have a stronger Java background than me.

Nick


Wow, how can u say this? You have been praising me the whole day... What's the matter with you?
Dirk Schreckmann
Sheriff

Joined: Dec 10, 2001
Posts: 7023
Do both.


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Nicholas Cheung
Ranch Hand

Joined: Nov 07, 2003
Posts: 4982

Do both.

Basically, we should do both and carry out some performance testing to see which is better. However, the 2 methods are totally with different apporaches. It may consume a lot of time.

Nick
James Redpath
Greenhorn

Joined: Aug 02, 2003
Posts: 13
Go for option 2 Pascal-Pl/SQL Oracle. Yes, it is true that Pascal is not used much; however, Pascal is taught to develop your logical thinking, a training in computer science. Also you need to know SQL not only PL/SQL but understanding the structure, syntax, and calls of this query language into a language like PL will help in using JDBC in the future. You must understand a Database first (i.e., understanding DDL vs. DQL, cursors, connections, etc.) before using JDBC or you will fall into the many pitfalls that many make in poor programming.

I know Java is sexy now and you want to jump in, but build a solid foundation first or you will be like the many poor programmers we have today.
Ben Wood
Ranch Hand

Joined: Aug 14, 2001
Posts: 342
How to get even more confused in one easy step? Easy, post a question like this! Of course, everyone answering has their own reasons for suggestion one route rather than another. I, for example, would go route 2 but purely on the basis that I have almost no interest in relational databases. I don't think not knowing much about DDL, DQL, PL-SQL, relational DB design will really affect you much if what you want to be is a programmer of some sort - take EJB's for example, which remove the need for developers hanging applications off DB tables to concern themselves with the query language. I think it a little unfair of James to suggest route 2 without route 1 would cause you to be a poor programmer. I use Java with ORACLE databases all the time both via JDBC and EJB's and my knowledge of Java and OO needs to be far more in-depth than what I need to know about ORACLE to get the job done. Database admin and design I leave up to the DBA and DB dev's, but if that's what you're interested in then route 1 is going to be the best option. Do what you enjoy most I say, otherwise you might find you'll follow a career simply because it appears to have better prospects...only to find either it doesn't, or that you don't enjoy your work. Have you discussed this with your tutors?


SCJP 1.4, www.gsi3d.org.uk
Tong Chen
Ranch Hand

Joined: Apr 26, 2002
Posts: 1011
It is really depending on what your career plan and your favorite is.
"Do both" is absolutely better choice.But,

If you want to go to "DBA", learn database harder, pick up either Oracle or MS SQL server.
If you want to go to "Developer", learn computer language and design harder, pick up either Java or C#. Don't waste your time in learning Pascal even Pascal is a good language for structured programming but it is really not good for OO programming.
If you want to go to "Project Manager", just skim about all the technical topics and learn how to do project management.

Of course there are a lot choices more than just two or three, and idea change is quicker than planning!


Tong Chen (Seattle USA)<br />SCJP,SCWCD,SCDJWS,IBM XML,MCP.NET,MCAD.NET,MCSD.NET
Sean Magee
Ranch Hand

Joined: Aug 23, 2004
Posts: 69
Thank you everyone for being so considerate in answering my questions. I have a couple more if you dont mind me asking (I wont cross post it either) The smartest thing (of course) for me to do is start out on both, so my first two classes are going to be "Introduction to Java" and "Database Development using DB2". What exactly is DB2? Where is a good place to look so I can get a head start on the Databse stuff to be more familiar on exactly what a "Table" is and so forth. And, because i only possess knowledg on Basic C, (do while loops, initializing header files not PRGRAMMING header files <--- way to above my head, for loops, you know the basics) will i be prpared to be introduced to JAVA?
Sean Magee
Ranch Hand

Joined: Aug 23, 2004
Posts: 69
use Java with ORACLE databases all the time both via JDBC and EJB's and my knowledge of Java and OO needs to be far more in-depth than what I need to know about ORACLE to get the job done.


I think that is what the course is trying to prepare me to do with the knowledge of JAVA
Warren Dew
blacksmith
Ranch Hand

Joined: Mar 04, 2004
Posts: 1332
    
    2
Heh. Should have answered the original question here instead of the beginner forum to increase my chances of winning that book....

In answer to your new question, I believe DB2 is IBM's database, and probably the closest competitor to Oracle.

To get a head start on what a database is, you might go to a bookstore and leaf through the first chapter of any database book - for example, "Core MySQL". You could try going to amazon.com and seeing if they've got that chapter on line as sample test.
Ko Ko Naing
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jun 08, 2002
Posts: 3178
Originally posted by James Redpath:
Go for option 2 Pascal-Pl/SQL Oracle. Yes, it is true that Pascal is not used much; however, Pascal is taught to develop your logical thinking, a training in computer science.

Is Pascal still taught as a computer programming course in this age? I guess most university eliminated the Pascal course and replaced with C/C++ or Java... They can be learnt not only to develop our logical thinking, but also to get to know most widely used languages...
Ko Ko Naing
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jun 08, 2002
Posts: 3178
Originally posted by Sean Magee:
What exactly is DB2? . .. . .. And, because i only possess knowledg on Basic C, (do while loops, initializing header files not PRGRAMMING header files <--- way to above my head, for loops, you know the basics) will i be prpared to be introduced to JAVA?


DB2 is a RDBMS by IBM... But Oracle seems more popular than DB2...
For the second question, if you know the very basics of C, then you are familiar with the programming logic already... So I belive you won't get trouble studying Java, if you give neccessary effords to learn it....

Hope it helps..
 
 
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