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Why the americans...

Hussein O'Baghdadi
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Joined: Oct 20, 2003
Posts: 40
Hi everybody, Merry Christmas to every one.
Maybe, as you note, I am the first arabian to post here (at least with real name).
I have read some of previous threads, and I want to comment on some points.
In thread "who is next?" some of you said Syria.
In thread "Evil dectators" also some of you said Syria.
Which lead me to a question: Do the Americans see in Syria an enemy, if they why?
If you think we hate americans, you are completely wrong.
I hope at the end of this thread, we all become friends.
Please note guys: we have a big diff in timing between us, so maybe I will be late in replying.
Paul McKenna
Ugly Redneck
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Joined: Jul 08, 2000
Posts: 1006
mm.. Welcome friend.. However I must ask you why you chose the name "Hussein Baghdadi" in particular. It seems like a mix of Saddam Hussein and Baghdad to me.. well Saddam Hussein is not exactly America's best friend and Baghdad isnt exactly very friendly to Americans right now. So why this combination? Or is your real name Hussein and you live in Baghdad..


Commentary From the Sidelines of history
Hussein O'Baghdadi
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Joined: Oct 20, 2003
Posts: 40
No it is my real name, I swear.
Hussein O'Baghdadi
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Joined: Oct 20, 2003
Posts: 40
Second, I hate Saddam, he is tyrant, and I want to thank USA for what she did for him (capturing him).
Paul McKenna
Ugly Redneck
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Joined: Jul 08, 2000
Posts: 1006
Welcome again friend.. so where exactly in the Arab world are you and what is your opinion of America and America's foreign policy. Perhaps you could help us by giving the missing perspective.
Hussein O'Baghdadi
Ranch Hand

Joined: Oct 20, 2003
Posts: 40
Hi Paul.
First: I dont have any thing against Americans ,I love americans(I have a freind from USA and I am a big fan of UTAH JAZZ).
and I am student in ALC.
But I don't agree with US forign policy(USA is the most powerfull country and must be wise not blind).
Be the way I am from Syria, and this is why I have asked:
Do the Americans see in Syria an enemy?
frank davis
Ranch Hand

Joined: Feb 12, 2001
Posts: 1479
Originally posted by Hussein Baghdadi:
Second, I hate Saddam, he is tyrant, and I want to thank USA for what she did for him (capturing him).

Yes, Welcome also friend.
Do most people you know feel this same way?
Our news media focuses on the people who hate Americans.
The US government sees Syria as a sponser of terrorism, but the average Anerican does not even think too much about Syria.
John Smith
Ranch Hand

Joined: Oct 08, 2001
Posts: 2937
Do the Americans see in Syria an enemy, if they why?
Well, I see at least a few reasons:
  • "You are either with us or against us"
  • Now that Afganistan and Iraq are down, we need another enemy
  • We've got an extra $70 billion for the war on terror, so we must spend it somewhere
  • Syrians don't celebrate Christmas, which means that they are condemned to hell unless liberated
  • Oil: we like to drive the military-type trucks on the highways but we refuse to pay more for a gallon of gas than we pay for a gallon of water
  • Golan Heights, -- this seems to be a nice chunk of land to place our heavy artillery
  • We suspect that Syria has on-going efforts to develop nuclear weapons and supports certain organizations, -- this is for big boys only
  • Our Commander In Chief extended the axis right through the evil, and Syria happened to be pinned. It's like shish kebab: various countries on a skewer (axis), and they are about to be grilled.


  • [ December 24, 2003: Message edited by: Eugene Kononov ]
    Hussein O'Baghdadi
    Ranch Hand

    Joined: Oct 20, 2003
    Posts: 40
    of course, there are people who love USA and others how hate USA (just like there are americans how love arabs and others who hate them).
    We have an americans basketball players in our league, we have the americans learning cernters, also british).
    but I think we are very misunderstood after 11/9
    Hussein O'Baghdadi
    Ranch Hand

    Joined: Oct 20, 2003
    Posts: 40
    Originally posted by Eugene Kononov:
    Do the Americans see in Syria an enemy, if they why?
    Well, I see at least a few reasons:
  • "You are either with us or against us"
  • Now that Afganistan and Iraq are down, we need another enemy
  • We've got an extra $70 billion for the war on terror, so we must spend it somewhere
  • Syrians don't celebrate Christmas, which means that they are condemned to hell unless liberated
  • Oil
  • Golan Heights
  • We suspect that Syria has on-going efforts to develop nuclear weapons, this is for big boys only

  • Hussein O'Baghdadi
    Ranch Hand

    Joined: Oct 20, 2003
    Posts: 40
    Who told you that Syrians don't celebrating in Christmas?
    If you could to come and see, you will see trees, santa close in every house , the people in the streets and churchs.
    Syria has a big number of christians.
    Paul McKenna
    Ugly Redneck
    Ranch Hand

    Joined: Jul 08, 2000
    Posts: 1006
    Friend Husseini
    I have a few questions for you..
    1. What about American foreign policy do you dislike
    2. What is the opinion in Syria about American action in Iraq
    3. Does Syria feel threatened by the west at present?
    John Smith
    Ranch Hand

    Joined: Oct 08, 2001
    Posts: 2937
    Syria has a big number of christians
    How about atheists? Another question: The CIA Factbook says that the median age in Syria is only 20 years, while life expectancy is around 70. What happens to all the elders?
    Hussein O'Baghdadi
    Ranch Hand

    Joined: Oct 20, 2003
    Posts: 40
    We see the US troops is occupation forces because they didn't come to Iraq with (UN decision).
    Syria has a very good relations with the west(UK, france, spain, italy, brazil....)
    and I think USA must be more netural between arabs and isreal (forgive me for some typing mistakes)
    Hussein O'Baghdadi
    Ranch Hand

    Joined: Oct 20, 2003
    Posts: 40
    What do you mean with (atheists, median)?
    my english is good not perfect.
    Rufus BugleWeed
    Ranch Hand

    Joined: Feb 22, 2002
    Posts: 1551
    There's a little matter of the marines we sent to Lebanon on a peace keeping mission that were murdered by Syrian sponsored terrorists.
    Hussein O'Baghdadi
    Ranch Hand

    Joined: Oct 20, 2003
    Posts: 40
    Ok guys, my clock now 5 AM and I must go to sleep, so see you tomorrow and merry christmas to every one.
    Joe Pluta
    Ranch Hand

    Joined: Jun 23, 2003
    Posts: 1376
    Well, I see at least a few reasons:
    My Christmas present to you Eugene: I'm not even going to respond.
    Merry Christmas everyone! (It is really Christmas now here.)
    Joe
    HS Thomas
    Ranch Hand

    Joined: May 15, 2002
    Posts: 3404
    after 11/9
    A decent representation of a date. Millions of people round the world will continue to get it wrong in their History lessons thinking it happened on the 9th of November.
    [ December 25, 2003: Message edited by: HS Thomas ]
    dennis zined
    Ranch Hand

    Joined: Mar 07, 2003
    Posts: 330
    I think he does mean Sept. 11. Some countries use the dd/mm/yyyy format.


    SCJP 1.4<br />SCWCD 1.4
    John Smith
    Ranch Hand

    Joined: Oct 08, 2001
    Posts: 2937
    Joe: My Christmas present to you Eugene: I'm not even going to respond.
    I know it took a lot of courage for you not to respond, Joe, and I appreciate your effort. What present would you like in return?
    HS Thomas
    Ranch Hand

    Joined: May 15, 2002
    Posts: 3404
    Originally posted by dennis zined:
    I think he does mean Sept. 11. Some countries use the dd/mm/yyyy format.

    In a recent conversation on the phone I must admit I said
    "You know 9/11, the 9th of November."
    The other person replied " 11/9 , the 11th of September".
    Though we both knew as we were speaking which event was meant.
    Mapraputa Is
    Leverager of our synergies
    Sheriff

    Joined: Aug 26, 2000
    Posts: 10065
    What present would you like in return?
    *I* wasn't asked this question, but I cannot help but to share this song I savor at the moment, I wish I could re-find it on the Internet!

    Here is another, just as as good as the first one.
    --------------------
    "A hug is all the home I have but you are welcome to it." --Michael Ernest


    Uncontrolled vocabularies
    "I try my best to make *all* my posts nice, even when I feel upset" -- Philippe Maquet
    John Smith
    Ranch Hand

    Joined: Oct 08, 2001
    Posts: 2937
    Map: I cannot help but to share this song I savor at the moment, I wish I could re-find it on the Internet!
    My Christmass gift to you, Map:
    your song lyrics and translation
    Mapraputa Is
    Leverager of our synergies
    Sheriff

    Joined: Aug 26, 2000
    Posts: 10065
    Eugene: My Christmass gift to you, Map:
    your song lyrics and translation

    Gee, I didn't know how to translate this one! And the words are as good as the music is!
    --------------------
    "A hug is all the home I have but you are welcome to it." --Michael Ernest
    Joe Pluta
    Ranch Hand

    Joined: Jun 23, 2003
    Posts: 1376
    I know it took a lot of courage for you not to respond, Joe,
    Courage? Nah, just patience. And the more I try the easier it is to ignore rhetoric.
    Joe
    John Smith
    Ranch Hand

    Joined: Oct 08, 2001
    Posts: 2937
    Originally posted by Joe Pluta:
    Courage? Nah, just patience. And the more I try the easier it is to ignore rhetoric.

    Rhetoric? Nah, just meaningless drivel.
    Kevin Thompson
    Ranch Hand

    Joined: May 04, 2001
    Posts: 237
    Hussain,
    We "Americans" are not monolithic. It might appear to people living abroad that we all Hail Ceasar, but that is really not the case.
    Eugene has it right. What else is there to say?
    As an American I am happy to identify what disturbs me about "American Foreign Policy"
    EVERY SINGLE THING!!!
    Kevin
    [ December 25, 2003: Message edited by: Kevin Thompson ]
    Hussein O'Baghdadi
    Ranch Hand

    Joined: Oct 20, 2003
    Posts: 40
    Welcome again guys.
    Again I want to ask the americans:
    Do you see in Syria an enemy?
    Michael Ernest
    High Plains Drifter
    Sheriff

    Joined: Oct 25, 2000
    Posts: 7292

    Not me, not today. Merry Christmas, Happy New Year. Peace to you, your family, and all of us.


    Make visible what, without you, might perhaps never have been seen.
    - Robert Bresson
    Hussein O'Baghdadi
    Ranch Hand

    Joined: Oct 20, 2003
    Posts: 40
    Ok, I think this thread is end.
    finally {
    thank you guys, and I hope I am a new friend here;
    god bless everyone on earth;
    Merry Christmas and happy new year;
    See you later;
    }
    Joe Pluta
    Ranch Hand

    Joined: Jun 23, 2003
    Posts: 1376
    As an American I am happy to identify what disturbs me about "American Foreign Policy"
    EVERY SINGLE THING!!!

    Wow, Kevin! Everything disturbs you! And since everything disturbs you, you must have a better way of doing everything. Now all you have to do is tell us what you would do everything differently if you were President!
    For example, tell us what you would have done differently in Kuwait. And how you would have handled Bin Laden. And then how to handle Israel and Palestine. And then your take on Afghanistan, and then Iraq. Tell us how you would handle the United Nations, and the World Trade Organization. What is your position on NAFTA? And what are your plans for North Korea? China? Pakistan?
    Come on, Kevin, if you've got the answers, I for one want to hear them!

    Merry Christmas, everyone! I made it through two out of three gatherings. One more to go. Wish me luck .
    Joe
    dennis zined
    Ranch Hand

    Joined: Mar 07, 2003
    Posts: 330
    Come on, Kevin, if you've got the answers, I for one want to hear them!

    hmm. this is interesting.
    Kevin Thompson
    Ranch Hand

    Joined: May 04, 2001
    Posts: 237
    Joe,
    I am glad to tell you! I could itemize it all - but the details and the country names don't matter!
    The US should have NO foreign policy. Stop the invasions and manipulations and occupations. It just pisses off people in foreign countries, in addition to gross violations of the principles of the Consitution and the Bill of Rights.
    If I was President of the United States, I would follow the Libertarian Party platform, which you can read about here ==>
    www.lp.org
    The world is full of corrupt and evil dictators. What is new with that? As for Bin Laden, he is a creation of Bush. Sr.
    As far as I can tell, the "agenda" of the "terrorists" appears to be this:
    1. Get the US legions out of the Middle East (espcially Saudi Arabia - the holy land for Muslims)
    2. Get the US foreign policy to be equitable (instead of favoriing Corrupt Evil Dictotor #1 over Corrupt Evil Dictator #2).
    3. Stop giving foreign aid to Corrupt Evil Dictators (like Saddam Hussein for decades!!!)
    4. Stop lying to our faces. (think about that WMD stuff! they are shameless in their lying!)
    what is fascinating - is that all of this sound so incredibly reasonable!!! Like something I want too!!
    On a compleely differnt topic, I would end the US Holocaust. I would let open the gates of the US Concentration Camps (free all those people in jail for victimless crimes.)
    Of course, as the US President, I would provide you the freedom to follow thru on your stong conviction about "making the world right". If you want to go abroad and fight in a foreign army to support "your cause" you should be free to do so! (Of course, this is ILLEGAL now - and you go to prison for this.) Or if you want to go around rasing money to "make the world right" - go for it!
    Just don't make the average American citizen pay for your "righteousness". Who are you to force me to pay (against my will) for your "righteousness" about how the world should be?

    Kevin
    John Smith
    Ranch Hand

    Joined: Oct 08, 2001
    Posts: 2937
    KT:
    1. Get the US legions out of the Middle East (espcially Saudi Arabia - the holy land for Muslims)
    2. Get the US foreign policy to be equitable (instead of favoriing Corrupt Evil Dictotor #1 over Corrupt Evil Dictator #2).
    3. Stop giving foreign aid to Corrupt Evil Dictators (like Saddam Hussein for decades!!!)
    4. Stop lying to our faces. (think about that WMD stuff! they are shameless in their lying!)
    what is fascinating - is that all of this sound so incredibly reasonable!!! Like something I want too!!

    I agree on all points, 'cept of the exclamation points. This particular piece of punctuation is a lazy substitute for well-phrased thoughts and ideas, and should be avoided as such.
    Joe Pluta
    Ranch Hand

    Joined: Jun 23, 2003
    Posts: 1376
    I'll ignore the affrontery of comparing prisons with Concentration Camps, and deal with one simple point to start with.
    free all those people in jail for victimless crimes
    What do you consider victimless crimes? And I hope you're not going to say drug use and prostitution; that's too easy.
    Joe
    Joe Pluta
    Ranch Hand

    Joined: Jun 23, 2003
    Posts: 1376
    1. Get the US legions out of the Middle East
    A strict isolationist policy implicitly condones the use of nerve gas on civilians. This is not America First, it's America Only.
    Joe
    paul wheaton
    Trailboss

    Joined: Dec 14, 1998
    Posts: 20272
        ∞

    Originally posted by Joe Pluta:
    For example, tell us what you would have done differently in Kuwait. And how you would have handled Bin Laden. And then how to handle Israel and Palestine. And then your take on Afghanistan, and then Iraq. Tell us how you would handle the United Nations, and the World Trade Organization. What is your position on NAFTA? And what are your plans for North Korea? China? Pakistan?
    Joe

    I'd like to take a stab at some of these.
    Kuwait ... I gave up on watching politics and that sort of thing a long time ago, so I confess that these are the ramblings of an ignorant boob. I remember that Iraq was our ally. I remember something about how we tried to negotiate with Kuwait (before the war) something like "you have no army. if you let us set up a base here, we'll protect you." and Kuwait told us to piss off (I'm sure they probably phrased it more diplomatically). Saddam was our own creation, so when they first attacked, I thought it was essentially the united states that was attacking Kuwait. As the story our media presented us unfolded, I was pretty confused. I ended up just thinking "Well, we elect people to do this kind of thinking for us so we don't have to. They have far more info than we do, so best to just let them do their work." Since then I've heard theories and stuff, but it all sounds like you'll just get an ulcer thinking about it.
    It sounded like Saddam had turned pretty icky. And if he took Kuwait, he might take a bunch of other countries too. And with all that oil, he could grow into a super power and possibly come and kick our butt. But that isn't something that you're gonna sell the american taxpayer on. So maybe that's the real reason we got involved - to keep the little bad guy from turning into a big bad guy. And I feel really weird about that reason. It's obviously wrong and it's obviously right.
    If I were president ... I probably would have not fought for kuwait and that would mean that as president, I would probably have ended up fighting a bigger army at a later date. But at least the reasoning would have been more obvious.
    Bin Laden: Again, one of our boys gone bad. Israel, Palestine and Afghanistan. Ug. Well, assuming that I had to react to 9/11, I cannot help but think that we could do anything other than what was done. Although, it kinda sends the message "Does your government suck? Rather than shooting them yourselves, just kill a bunch of Americans and blame your governement. We'll come wipe them out and then build schools and roads for you."
    As weird as it sounds, I wonder if a cure for the mid east is .... Laverne and Shirley. I wonder if we set it up so everybody could get five tv stations of sit coms, special interest shows, sports and general entertainment ... maybe folks would watch a little more tv rather than thinking about how to hurt somebody. The modern opiate of the masses.
    Okay, I now remember why I avoided politics. It makes me tired and depressed. And I know that if I ever share a political opinion, people will hate me. I think I'll go write a servlet ....


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    Joe Pluta
    Ranch Hand

    Joined: Jun 23, 2003
    Posts: 1376
    And I know that if I ever share a political opinion, people will hate me.
    You know, Paul, that's actually a pretty wise statement. I continually get drawn into these conversations, even though I know I shouldn't - kind of like playing with a hangnail. And it's no win.
    Personally, I think I agree with the Laverne and Shirley approach to world peace. Or maybe it's an XBox, and you settle your inter-governmental squabbles through giant XBox live tournaments. That would work...
    Joe
    Thomas Paul
    mister krabs
    Ranch Hand

    Joined: May 05, 2000
    Posts: 13974
    Originally posted by Paul Wheaton:
    Kuwait ... I gave up on watching politics and that sort of thing a long time ago, so I confess that these are the ramblings of an ignorant boob. I remember that Iraq was our ally. I remember something about how we tried to negotiate with Kuwait (before the war) something like "you have no army. if you let us set up a base here, we'll protect you." and Kuwait told us to piss off (I'm sure they probably phrased it more diplomatically). Saddam was our own creation, so when they first attacked, I thought it was essentially the united states that was attacking Kuwait. As the story our media presented us unfolded, I was pretty confused. I ended up just thinking "Well, we elect people to do this kind of thinking for us so we don't have to. They have far more info than we do, so best to just let them do their work." Since then I've heard theories and stuff, but it all sounds like you'll just get an ulcer thinking about it.
    I can see that you don't follow politics much. Iraq was never an ally of the US. One need only look at the list of weapons in the Iraq army to see that. everything they use is either Russian or French made. During the Cold War, Saddam was a friend of the USSR not the USA. Kuwait has been a friend of the US for a long time. We never asked Kuwait to build a base there.


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