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astrology/numerology

himanshu patel
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Joined: Feb 03, 2003
Posts: 205
To what extend astrology can predict future?I always wonder how these planets, thousands miles away from earth can affects our future? How its bad affects can be nullified by wearing stones in finger ring? Would you like to share your experience/opinion? Have you ever experienced any incident where your furure prediction got true ?


If you want to become a rich, do not work for others but make others to work for you.
Madhav Lakkapragada
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Joined: Jun 03, 2000
Posts: 5040
I don't know why it works or how it works.....but I have seen a
lot of bad things happen when someone said thigs were looking bad...
And I realized whatever happens will happens - for good for
bad whatever that's just life.......
My phylosophical two cents.....


Take a Minute, Donate an Hour, Change a Life
http://www.ashanet.org/workanhour/2006/?r=Javaranch_ML&a=81
Arjun Shastry
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Joined: Mar 13, 2003
Posts: 1874
I don't believe in these things but experience is that astrology/palmistry is empirical science,thats what many believe.I have met 2 astrologers who have accurately told my past.There is definitely much sense in palimistry but the directions of these lines are decided by human being.Our future is always in our hand. .But some astrologers tell yours past ,precisely.How they tell by planet positions is still a mystery.But the fact is they tell your past correctly.


MH
Varun Khanna
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Joined: May 30, 2002
Posts: 1400
Other day my friend met an astroleger who told him that he left his previous job on 6th of July 2003 (which was true) !!!
Looks astrologers are also getting into HR & recruitment business :roll: :roll:


- Varun
himanshu patel
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Joined: Feb 03, 2003
Posts: 205
Originally posted by Capablanca Kepler:
......But the fact is they tell your past correctly.

if they can tell past correctly, than why can't future?
himanshu patel
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Joined: Feb 03, 2003
Posts: 205
Originally posted by Varun Khanna:
Other day my friend met an astroleger who told him that he left his previous job on 6th of July 2003 (which was true) !!!

Why don't astrolger predict their own past/future?
himanshu patel
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Joined: Feb 03, 2003
Posts: 205
Originally posted by Capablanca Kepler:
...There is definitely much sense in palimistry but the directions of these lines are decided by human being.

My one of friend told me that lines are getting changed in period of time.
Lines after 5 years may not be the same as today.I use to argue with him that if it was the case than if i work as farmer insted of S/w,than my lines will not be changed? The lines of poor people who have to work hard using their hands will not chnage early than the people who do not use their hand much?
himanshu patel
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Joined: Feb 03, 2003
Posts: 205
Originally posted by Capablanca Kepler:
....Our future is always in our hand. .

This reminds me the days of college where in toilet i use to read this
slogan
Varun Khanna
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Joined: May 30, 2002
Posts: 1400
Originally posted by himanshu patel:

My one of friend told me that lines are getting changed in period of time.
Lines after 5 years may not be the same as today.I use to argue with him that if it was the case than if i work as farmer insted of S/w,than my lines will not be changed? The lines of poor people who have to work hard using their hands will not chnage early than the people who do not use their hand much?

As per my knowledge, the line of our working (primary) hand changes but of non-working hand doesn't. Lines of non-working hand shows what our destiny was when we were born and of non-working hand shows he we "changed" (in my case "scrood") it up by our deeds.
They says lines of hands are changed or created depending upon the way we fold ur hand, and with every thought that we carry in our mind (or thing we do)we fold our hand in some particular way ... which eventually creates a line.
P.S. btw, one thing I am sure about palmistery --> If you know it (or even if you pretend so) chances are high that girls will be attracted towards you
himanshu patel
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Joined: Feb 03, 2003
Posts: 205
Originally posted by Varun Khanna:

As per my knowledge, the line of our working (primary) hand changes but of non-working hand doesn't. Lines of non-working hand shows what our destiny was when we were born and of non-working hand shows he we "changed" (in my case "scrood") it up by our deeds.

How do i know which of my hand is non-working bcoz i use both hands on keyborads.

P.S. btw, one thing I am sure about palmistery --> If you know it (or even if you pretend so) chances are high that girls will be attracted towards you

Thats absolutely true....My friend used to do so.
Manish Hatwalne
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Joined: Sep 22, 2001
Posts: 2578

I am not really sure about predicting future, but since I have studied Palmistry and Numerology, I can say that you can predict nature and traits in a person with reasonable accuracy. Lines do change though, I have seen it. Watch hand of a 14/15 year old, and folow it for next 10-15 year as his career developes...
Well known and respectable palmist/astrologers believe that it's more of an art of interprestation of the knowledge that you one has aquired.
- Manish
Jeroen Wenting
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Joined: Oct 12, 2000
Posts: 5093
The planets and stars cannot change our destiny in the way that astrology claims they can, at least not directly.
The same is true for numbers and numerology.
Of course, if people start ACTING on the belief that these predictions are worth anything at all, the predictions might turn out to be self-fullfilling prophesies.
For example, someone who's told by an atrologist he has only a week at most to live might start taking all sorts of risks he would otherwise have avoided and get killed in the process. Astrology adherents would see that as a sign that the stars were correct when in fact the person would likely never have died in that period had he not known about that prophesy.
Of course with numbers it's slightly different, but that's mainly the numbers on your taxreturn which are not arrived at by any science more obscure than government budget calculations
[ February 23, 2004: Message edited by: Jeroen Wenting ]

42
Arjun Shastry
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Joined: Mar 13, 2003
Posts: 1874
But then how to explain the fact that some astrolgers tell the past accurately?and sometimes future also?(They might not tell eaxct future but some important events might occur in your future).
Genereally the people in a profession of 'chance' tend to go to astrologers.For example politicians/actors/actresses/Share brokers/businesses(in some countries).In these profession ,sucess partly depends on Luck.
Jeroen Wenting
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Joined: Oct 12, 2000
Posts: 5093
Deception and good listening.
First have a nice talk with the subject/victim in which you touch on a lot of personal matters. Then during the "session" you suddenly "discover" all those things that happened in the past.
Better yet is if the victim is brought in by someone else who knows the victim well. That person may well have disclosed that information in the past without even knowing it.
As to the future, see above for self-fullfilling prophesies.
Also, a lot of things happen to almost everyone. If an astrologer tells a man he'll find a woman he loves and marry here, that's hardly a hard guess to make as that happens to the majority of people and combined with the self-fullfilling prophesy is even more likely to happen.
Then there's the human tendency to remember nice things more clearly than bad news, so astrologers will usually concentrate mainly on positive things.
Sameer Jamal
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Joined: Feb 16, 2001
Posts: 1870
Astrology (Jyotish) originated in India long back when most of the trading was done through the sea route, traders from India and other asian countries used to go to european countries like Rome to sell their spices, but it takes a long time 6 months or more to reach there and it also require the knowledge of position of stars so sailors always move in the right direction. When the trading was done then these people remain idle most of the time until the next trade start so they begin to use their knowledge of stars to fool people and the subjects like astrology came in to existence all the other subjects like palmistry numerology etc are originated from this only. So it is useless to beleive in such kind of rubbish which have actually no scientific background.
Few people may argue that Astrology is a science but it never fits in any definition of science. It is kind of a perfect subject which cannot be changed and is linked to the religion so people should beleive in that nonsense.
R K Singh
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Joined: Oct 15, 2001
Posts: 5371
Originally posted by Sameer Jamal:
and is linked to the religion so people should beleive in that nonsense.

hmm .. I dont think astrology is linked with religion.
AW its a science or not, its debatable. When science itself is a collection of hypothesis then wny cant astrology be science


"Thanks to Indian media who has over the period of time swiped out intellectual taste from mass Indian population." - Chetan Parekh
Dmitry Melnik
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Joined: Dec 18, 2003
Posts: 328
When I was a kid there were 3 couples of twins in our class. I mean born the same place, the same day, the same hour, minutes apart (each pair) Their lives went very differen. Not as different as often shown in soap operas, but almost And I know planets don't move that fast...
Sara Jahan
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Joined: Apr 20, 2003
Posts: 120
Originally posted by Dmitry Melnik:
When I was a kid there were 3 couples of twins in our class. I mean born the same place, the same day, the same hour, minutes apart (each pair) Their lives went very differen. Not as different as often shown in soap operas, but almost And I know planets don't move that fast...

As per Indian astrology, you need exact time of birth (in terms of hours and minutes) to get accurate predicton of one's future. But again the "esact time of birth" is debatable. What is time of birth - When the baby's head comes out or the feet? Who sits with a clock to record the "exact time of birth"? Is there any guarantee that the clock used for recording the time of birth is correct?
/Sara
Paul Stevens
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Joined: May 17, 2001
Posts: 2823
Originally posted by Capablanca Kepler:
But then how to explain the fact that some astrolgers tell the past accurately?

I almost always get the past correct. It is that pesky future that I have problems with.
South Park had an episode devoted to this. It was quite entertaining.
Joe King
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Joined: Sep 02, 2003
Posts: 820
Ignoring rocks actually hitting the earth, its pretty crazy that some people think that some lumps of rock a million miles away can directly affect things like how well they will do in a job interview and when they will get married. Mind you, some people believe in father christmas, a magical creature which created the entire universe in 6 days, the tooth fairy, UFOs etc. There must be something seriously wrong with the human brain.
Arjun Shastry
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Joined: Mar 13, 2003
Posts: 1874
Correct,but then mystery still remains.How some astrologers tell your past correctly and sometimes future?Jereon,you are partially correct.But sometimes they tell exactly.25 years back ,one of my relative's parents showed horoscope of bride.Astrolger told that this proposal is not suitable and reconsider the decision.Groom's parents declined.Couple seperated after 4 years of marriage.I think astrology is an art than science.There are astrologers who tell your past/future just be watching a horoscope without even watching a person.Even if they tell more than 50% of person's past correctly,it can not be called nonsense.
[ February 24, 2004: Message edited by: Capablanca Kepler ]
Thomas Paul
mister krabs
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Joined: May 05, 2000
Posts: 13974
This is a true story...
An astrologer visited a college class and asked quetions of each student. He returned a week later with, as he told the class, a custom made horoscope for each student. He passed them out and had the students read them and evaluate the information. Every student in the room agreed that the information in the horoscope was accurate and demonstrated an amazingly astute analysis of each student. The astrologer then had the students show the horoscope tyo the student next to them. The students then realized that every horoscope was absolutely identical. They had been faked.
The "astrologer" was actually the Amazing Randi, a famous debunker of astrology.
Even after the debunking, 40% of the students still beleived in astrology.
Mani Ram
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Joined: Mar 11, 2002
Posts: 1140
Originally posted by Capablanca Kepler:
Couple seperated after 4 years of marriage.

There are couples getting separated even after approved by an astrologer and there are couples living happily after negative suggestions by the same astrologer!
There is another name for these sort of things -> co-incidence


Mani
Quaerendo Invenietis
Thomas Paul
mister krabs
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Joined: May 05, 2000
Posts: 13974
Originally posted by Mani Ram:
There is another name for these sort of things -> co-incidence

If I tell you that it will rain on July 15th and I will tell someone else that it will be sunny on July 15th then I will one person going around saying what a great psychic I am.
Most psychics work by throwing a few million predictions out. One or two are bound to come true just from chance but those are the ones everyone remembers.
Terimaki Tojay
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Joined: Nov 24, 2003
Posts: 165
Originally posted by Joe King:
Ignoring rocks actually hitting the earth, its pretty crazy that some people think that some lumps of rock a million miles away can directly affect things like how well they will do in a job interview and when they will get married.

I have swayed both ways on this but this argument is no good. If a lump of rock that exists millions of miles away can exert gravitational force on some other rock, then why can't it exert some other kind of force that we don't know about???
One direct consequence of gravitational force is the general strength of muscles of animals. You can walk on earth, jump 100 feet on moon but may only crawl on Jupitor. So why can't some unknown force of this rock affect some other parameters of life?
Theoretically, I have no objection in believing that heavenly bodies affect humans. Practically, however, I have my doubts.
Originally posted by Joe King:
There must be something seriously wrong with the human brain.

Now that I totally agree with
Terimaki Tojay
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Joined: Nov 24, 2003
Posts: 165
Originally posted by Thomas Paul:

If I tell you that it will rain on July 15th and I will tell someone else that it will be sunny on July 15th then I will one person going around saying what a great psychic I am.

Except that it is not that trivial and not everybody is so stupid. There are well known scientists, expert in their fields, who also believe in this.
Matt Cao
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Joined: Apr 03, 2003
Posts: 715
Hi,
Astrology/numerology are cosmic code of you since the day your pa sperm penetrated your ma egg. Some of you are not destined to be born and some do.
The unique about human species that we are very close to God. You could alter your destiny by changing your bad habbits/way-of-life. But you cannot change it totally because you have to change your look, your DNA, and whatever make you is you. No other species can.
All religions preachers alway tell us to stay away from bad deeds all stem from the root of astrology/numerology.
While was in college in my younger years, I developed the database program for a fortune-teller that how I know some of his tricks. You see there are pattern of stars line-up and the way people looks/behaviors. It is not a core science, but definitely not a junk science.
You people across cultures and religions tend not to believe it, old people do. Why? they live long enough to see the cycles of life and souls travel in packs.

Oh Crap! I feel twilight-zone movies marathone is on rerun again.
Regards,
MCao
Sadanand Murthy
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Joined: Nov 26, 2003
Posts: 382
Joe King: There must be something seriously wrong with the human brain.
Terimaki Tojay: Now that I totally agree with

Speak for yourselves, humans.
There is nothing wrong with my brain. But, I'm not a mere human; I am a super-human.


Ever Existing, Ever Conscious, Ever-new Bliss
Sadanand Murthy
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Joined: Nov 26, 2003
Posts: 382
The problem with many of us is that we won't/don't/can't believe something unless:
  • Science can prove it to us that it is or isn't, or
  • Our own physical senses tell us that it is or isn't


  • Unfortunately, science doesn't know everything and what it knows today may prove to be wrong tomorrow. We cannot always rely on our physical senses for knowledge.
    So, if both science and our own physical senses are fallible, then we cannot with certainty say that astrology/numerology is bunk because science cannot prove that it is not bunk. At the same time we cannot say that it is not bunk because science cannot prove that it is bunk.
    There certainly are many things in this universe that science doesn't know about but that doesn't mean that they don't exist. So, perhaps, as TT pointed out, there is a type of force that these rocks have that science cannot as yet see that has some effect on us that science as yet cannot measure. If anything, the last 150 years of advances in science & technology have shown me that I cannot make absolute statements based on scientific knowledge or rather lack of it.
    Steven Broadbent
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    Joined: Dec 10, 2002
    Posts: 400
    lets have poll of developers star signs:-
    me - Cancer


    "....bigmouth strikes again, and I've got no right to take my place with the human race...."<p>SCJP 1.4
    Dmitry Melnik
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    Joined: Dec 18, 2003
    Posts: 328
    Sounds like a team-matching meeting
    Thomas Paul
    mister krabs
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    Joined: May 05, 2000
    Posts: 13974
    Originally posted by Terimaki Tojay:
    Except that it is not that trivial and not everybody is so stupid. There are well known scientists, expert in their fields, who also believe in this.

    Experts in "their" fields? Just because a person is an expert in one field does not make then an expert in debunking this stuff. People are easily fooled. Try subscribing to The Skeptical Inquirer if you want to learn the truth about pseudo-science.
    Terimaki Tojay
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    Joined: Nov 24, 2003
    Posts: 165
    Originally posted by Thomas Paul:

    Experts in "their" fields? Just because a person is an expert in one field does not make then an expert in debunking this stuff. People are easily fooled. Try subscribing to The Skeptical Inquirer if you want to learn the truth about pseudo-science.

    Again, you missed the point. You gave a very trivial example of how one can fool people. My argument is that everybody is not that stupid. Yes, there ARE stupid people but there are some very smart people also who believe in this. So the matter is not as simple as you think it is. If somebody is an expert in one field that tells me that tells me something about his/her intellect. You can't just write everybody off as stupid.
    himanshu patel
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    Joined: Feb 03, 2003
    Posts: 205
    I do agree that there must be some unknown force of these rock exist but do not understand how they affect our fourtune. If sun rays are spread equally over all human then how come the strength of such force are vary from person to person.If force is equal to all human then fortune of all human should be same.
    I may possible that this unknown force might affect health of human but do not understand how they affect wealth. How one planet affect one human but do not affect another though its force is contineoulsy spread all over earth. Why this force are not same for all human like gravitational force. The density of sun rays are vary from place to place not human to human.If the temparature of Newyork is 10C, then it is same for all who lives in NY.Then how come strength of such unknown force is different from person to person.
    How to decide whether this force have bad or good affect on person?
    By wearing different stone in finger ring how we can counter its bad affect.? Does these stone works like a dish antena which attracts more force?
    [ February 24, 2004: Message edited by: himanshu patel ]
    Thomas Paul
    mister krabs
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    Joined: May 05, 2000
    Posts: 13974
    Originally posted by Terimaki Tojay:
    You can't just write everybody off as stupid.
    It's not about stupidity. It is about gullibility and lack of specific knowledge.
    Some very bright people invested their fortunes in perpetual motion machines even though they are impossible and would violatee every law of physics. Have you ever watched a magician and been amazed? What if the magician acted as if the tricks were real? Don't you think many people, even intelligent people, would be fooled? Before you say no, you might want to think about that famous spoon bender Uri Geller who has been proven a fraud many times but people still beleive in him. The best person for finding a fraud is not a person with a PhD; it is a person who knows magic, someone like the Amazing Randi.
    Try this for starters:
    http://www.astrosociety.org/education/astro/act3/astrology3.html
    Thomas Paul
    mister krabs
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    Joined: May 05, 2000
    Posts: 13974
    Originally posted by himanshu patel:
    I do agree that there must be some unknown force of these rock exist but do not understand how they affect our fourtune.
    let's pretend for a moment that there really is such a force. Why would the moment of birth be significant? Is the force unable to pass through the placenta? And wouldn't the force effect everyone equally? Why would the date of my birth make a rock effect me more than it effects someone else? How does the rock know when I was born? The silliness of trying to make a scientific theory out of this becomes quickly apparent when you bother to think about it and ask some serious questions.
    Mani Ram
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    Joined: Mar 11, 2002
    Posts: 1140
    Originally posted by Steven Broadbent:
    lets have poll of developers star signs:-

    Scorpio
    Thomas Paul
    mister krabs
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    Joined: May 05, 2000
    Posts: 13974
    Originally posted by Steven Broadbent:
    lets have poll of developers star signs:-
    Mint chocolate chip
    Mani Ram
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    Joined: Mar 11, 2002
    Posts: 1140
    From the movie Matrix:

    Morpheus: Do you believe in fate, Neo?
    Neo: No
    Morpheus: Why not?
    Neo: Because I don't like the idea that I'm not in control of my life.

    Whether Astrology / Numerology is true or not, I don't care about it exactly for this same reason.
    Mani Ram
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    Joined: Mar 11, 2002
    Posts: 1140
    Originally posted by Thomas Paul:
    Mint chocolate chip

    Hmmm....that explains a lot
     
    I agree. Here's the link: http://aspose.com/file-tools
     
    subject: astrology/numerology
     
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