aspose file tools*
The moose likes Meaningless Drivel and the fly likes paying tips at beauty salons or hair cutting salons Big Moose Saloon
  Search | Java FAQ | Recent Topics | Flagged Topics | Hot Topics | Zero Replies
Register / Login
JavaRanch » Java Forums » Other » Meaningless Drivel
Bookmark "paying tips at beauty salons or hair cutting salons" Watch "paying tips at beauty salons or hair cutting salons" New topic
Author

paying tips at beauty salons or hair cutting salons

trupti nigam
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jun 21, 2001
Posts: 613
Hi All,

How much tip should one offer at the beauty salons or at the hair cutting salons (in USA)? When I came to US few years back this concept was totally new for me and came to know about it through some of my friends.
I am not against offering tips. Just want to know how much everyone offers or what is the decent range?


Thanks,
Trupti
John Dunn
slicker
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jan 30, 2003
Posts: 1108
Depends on how much you care about the look of your hair.


"No one appreciates the very special genius of your conversation as the dog does."
David Harkness
Ranch Hand

Joined: Aug 07, 2003
Posts: 1646
I figure since they get to keep the hair they cut, that should be good enough. Similarly, if I only finish half the food on my plate at a restaurant, there's no need to leave a tip since they can finish my meal.
Jeroen Wenting
Ranch Hand

Joined: Oct 12, 2000
Posts: 5093
Tipping in the US has gone over the top. You're now getting dirty looks if you don't tip even for substandard work and there's been at least case where a person has been sued for not tipping...

IMO tipping should be reserved for those cases where the staff went beyond their job description to provide you the best possible service, it shouldn't be something expected for lackluster assembly line work.


42
ammu vasanth
Ranch Hand

Joined: Sep 04, 2004
Posts: 47
10 bucks.
Ernest Friedman-Hill
author and iconoclast
Marshal

Joined: Jul 08, 2003
Posts: 24187
    
  34

The size of the tip depends on the quality of the service and the size of the bill. For a serviceable $10 haircut, 2-3 dollars is a fine tip. If you go in a salon and drop $250 on a wash, cut, dye, style, etc, etc, then you might tip a total of $50 or so, divided among the various people who worked on you.

So something like 20% is typical, more for better service, less for worse.

Jeroen's assertion that tips should be offered only for exemplary service definitely isn't appropriate for the U.S. The tax and wage laws are designed such that employers can pay some employees less than the legal minimum wage, assuming that they'll more than make up the difference in tips. Not tipping a waitress, especially, is a cruel and spiteful thing to do. Leaving a smaller tip for poor service is one thing; not tipping at all if the service is just average is simply being a jerk.


[Jess in Action][AskingGoodQuestions]
Jeroen Wenting
Ranch Hand

Joined: Oct 12, 2000
Posts: 5093
In that case the system is wrong and people are not in any way motivated to provide more than bland service (which is indeed what I notice in many places in the US).

A $10 haircut? Where? Haven't seen any place offering them for under �20 around here for years.

And no, tips are not normally given here except in restaurants.
Ernest Friedman-Hill
author and iconoclast
Marshal

Joined: Jul 08, 2003
Posts: 24187
    
  34

Originally posted by Jeroen Wenting:

A $10 haircut? Where? Haven't seen any place offering them for under �20 around here for years.


Well, I was rounding down, I guess. I pay $14, which is about �10 . But that's in a "barbershop" -- a place that's resolutely not a "salon" of any sort!
John Dunn
slicker
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jan 30, 2003
Posts: 1108
And no, tips are not normally given here except in restaurants.
Precicesly why Americans look so much better...
Jeroen Wenting
Ranch Hand

Joined: Oct 12, 2000
Posts: 5093
Originally posted by Ernest Friedman-Hill:


Well, I was rounding down, I guess. I pay $14, which is about �10 . But that's in a "barbershop" -- a place that's resolutely not a "salon" of any sort!


A "salon" (so a posh place) here would charge upward of �50 for a haircut...

Precicesly why Americans look so much better


Americans are so naive
Hu Jiabao
Ranch Hand

Joined: Feb 16, 2004
Posts: 39
Instead of receiving the money for giving the hair in a saloon,you give so much money to saloon? .
You give your hair and you give your money too.weird.


working in Shanghai CHINA PRC
Marc Peabody
pie sneak
Sheriff

Joined: Feb 05, 2003
Posts: 4727

Originally posted by Ernest Friedman-Hill:

Jeroen's assertion that tips should be offered only for exemplary service definitely isn't appropriate for the U.S. The tax and wage laws are designed such that employers can pay some employees less than the legal minimum wage, assuming that they'll more than make up the difference in tips. Not tipping a waitress, especially, is a cruel and spiteful thing to do. Leaving a smaller tip for poor service is one thing; not tipping at all if the service is just average is simply being a jerk.


Most Americans I know agree with this. I do not completely agree.

If the service is very poor, I leave a very small tip and I do not return to the place of business. In a few notable experiences I have left nothing at all. I refuse to reward it. If the person providing the service is incapable of providing decent service, said person should consider getting a job where they do not depend on my tip.
If the service is average, I give about 15%. If the service is spectacular they will get 30% or more.


A good workman is known by his tools.
Jesse Torres
Ranch Hand

Joined: Mar 25, 2004
Posts: 985
Originally posted by Marc Peabody:


Most Americans I know agree with this. I do not completely agree.

If the service is very poor, I leave a very small tip and I do not return to the place of business. In a few notable experiences I have left nothing at all. I refuse to reward it. If the person providing the service is incapable of providing decent service, said person should consider getting a job where they do not depend on my tip.
If the service is average, I give about 15%. If the service is spectacular they will get 30% or more.



I completely agree with you. If the service is bad, I also leave a small tip and don't return to the establishment. If I find a barber or hair cutter who performs a good job, then I give at least 30% tip.

There are still barbershops in U.S that charge $10 for hair cut.
Warren Dew
blacksmith
Ranch Hand

Joined: Mar 04, 2004
Posts: 1332
    
    2
Ernest Friedman-Hill:

Jeroen's assertion that tips should be offered only for exemplary service definitely isn't appropriate for the U.S.

The service in the U.S. is always exemplary ... compared to, say, service in China back when it was still Maoist.

I believe in zero based tipping. If there's no service - the table hasn't been cleared or cleaned when I sit down, no one ever shows up to take an order, no water or food is ever delivered - I don't tip. Anything above that merits a tip.

I usually tip $4 on the $17 haircut I get at a salon. Unfortunately, one doesn't really know how good a haircut is until it has grown in a bit, so it's harder to adjust the tip to the quality of the service.
fred rosenberger
lowercase baba
Bartender

Joined: Oct 02, 2003
Posts: 11476
    
  16

...it's harder to adjust the tip to the quality of the service.

should you tip on the quality of the SERVICE, or the quiality of the PRODUCT??? If a person is nice, friendly, prompt, etc, but gives me a lousy haircut, how much do you tip them?

whereas if the haircut is the best i've ever had, but i had to wait 20 minutes past my appointment time, the stylist has B.O., they're rude, take cell phone calls in the middle of my haircut, i'm probably NOT going to tip them much of anything...


There are only two hard things in computer science: cache invalidation, naming things, and off-by-one errors
Eric Pascarello
author
Rancher

Joined: Nov 08, 2001
Posts: 15376
    
    6
By yourself a flowbee...lol
Marc Peabody
pie sneak
Sheriff

Joined: Feb 05, 2003
Posts: 4727

Originally posted by fred rosenberger:
should you tip on the quality of the SERVICE, or the quiality of the PRODUCT???


It is rare to get great service coupled with a bad product. As far as haircuts go, the product and service are inseparable.

About a year ago I had a stylist that was unsure of how to do some layering technique (my hair was a tad longer then) so she asked another stylist for assistance. She wanted to provide the best possible product and I equate that to good service. She got a 50% tip.
Ganapathi Srinivasan
Ranch Hand

Joined: Apr 18, 2001
Posts: 41
This is my personal opinion as well as practice...I tip 2-3 dollars (normally round it off) for a haircut..in restaurants i tip 15-20%, except for buffets or "all-you-can-eat" stuff..there i again depend on my "round-it-off" principle..at gas stations i tip $1 in summers and $2 in winters (a sign of appreciation for what the person at the pump goes thru to stand in the freezing cold)...

for people in US who r wondering what I am talking abt tips at gas stations...i live in New Jersey! we r too lazy to pump gas

[ March 30, 2005: Message edited by: Ganapathi Raman ]
[ March 30, 2005: Message edited by: Ganapathi Raman ]
Eric Pascarello
author
Rancher

Joined: Nov 08, 2001
Posts: 15376
    
    6
Haircut--
I tip $2.05 used to be $3.05 when the price was a dollar cheaper...(I pay $12.95 now... + $2.05 = $15.00)

GAS --
Jersey is trying to make jobs...

I still love it..New Jersey has the lowest price for gas and they pay people to pump it....

Eric
Alan Wanwierd
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jun 30, 2004
Posts: 624
Amazing the differences in culture....

Here in Australia tipping is a geernal no-no. If I tried to give a tip when I got my hair cut (AU$15 for <10 minutes work), the poor guy would be confused and quite possibly offended!

In many circumstances offering a tip is like suggesting "Gee- you must be desperate if you're prepared to do this kind of work! - I feel sorry for you"..

The reality in Australia is that hairdressing is actually a regarded as a good job - often self-employed, low-stress (That said, there is a nationwide shortage and hairdressing is TOP of the list of "desired professions" to get skills-based migrants from the Dept. of Immigration).....

In restaurants waiting staff are paid an appropriate wage (usually above the specified award wage minimums set by government)and tipping is not unversal or even common - I would offer a small tip (<10%) If I feel the service was 'above and beyond' expectation and the waiter/waitress was particularly friendly or helpful, but if the service is merely satisfactory then I regard tipping as unnecessary.

Theres a bit of a feeling that if a tip is expected, then the establishment is indulging in "false advertising". If the menu says my dinner is going to cost me $20, I want to pay $20 for it - If the staff are going to get shitty because I didnt pay them $25, then they should show $25 as the price!
Gail Mikels
Ranch Hand

Joined: May 07, 2001
Posts: 634
What I've always thought was the "norm" for tipping hairdressers was 15%, +/- based on how pleased you are with the service. But Adrian reminded me - I've heard that you don't tip a hairdresser who is self-employed. How can you tell if they're self-employed or not? I think some "salons" rent booth space to self-employed people, others hire them...


Gail Mikels
Alan Wanwierd
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jun 30, 2004
Posts: 624
....and then theres the question of gender equality:

Recently a group of women tried to argue a case for sex discrimination throughout the hairdressing industry, pointing out that the price of womens and mens cuts was often different at the same salon.

To me this is ridiculous - I spend $15 on 10 minutes of work and have never once returned for a 'touch-up', never have expensive product applied to my head and generally am a very easy customer... I'm am led to believe that this is not uncommon for male customers (although I accept that there are plenty of exceptions - the *norm* is for a low-maintenance, quick transaction)

With a female haircut the norm is a *much* longer appointment time (think >600% increase), much greater use of expensive hair product, and much greater chance of complaint and retrun visit to fix up 'problem'.

As it is my guy will do perhaps 8 hair 'cuts' in an hour earning him $120 - More than a decent wage, (twice what I could get as a java-contractor) - and no doubt enough to cover his business rental overheads, particularly as his wife cuts at the same rate. (Theres no way these guys need a tip to survive!)

All in all I'm reasonably offended that my haircut is still no less than 1/7th the cost of my wifes! (If the costs were the same I'd get myself a set of shears and indulge in some highly cost-effective self-maintanence)
Sania Marsh
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jul 12, 2004
Posts: 469
Many hairsalons already have the tip included in the price.
It's ok to ask about that before the cut.
If it is regular quick-cut kind of place 10-15% tip is what is usually paid. For fancy salons 15-20% for cut and 10% for wash should be good enough.
One may add 5-10% more if the service was very good.
Jeroen Wenting
Ranch Hand

Joined: Oct 12, 2000
Posts: 5093
same here Adrian. No tips except in restaurants (and possibly tourguides).

Any place that has the tip included on the bill will get that amount deducted by me. I will decided whether to tip or not (and how much), I won't accept someone deciding that their service was good enough to charge me whichever percentage over the real price.
And he won't get any tip if he does that, even if he'd have gotten more than that amount had it not been "included".
Dave Lenton
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jan 20, 2005
Posts: 1241
Originally posted by Ernest Friedman-Hill:
Jeroen's assertion that tips should be offered only for exemplary service definitely isn't appropriate for the U.S. The tax and wage laws are designed such that employers can pay some employees less than the legal minimum wage, assuming that they'll more than make up the difference in tips.

This is totally crazy. Why have a minimum wage and then let employers pay less? They can't assume that all customers will pay a tip without making the tip compulsory, in which case it is an extra tax. If you can't guarantee that customers will pay tips, then you can't guarantee that the minimum wage will be paid. How on earth is this better than a system where the staff are paid the minimum wage and tips are not expected? At least that way customers know that the price on the bill is what they will be paying.
Not tipping a waitress, especially, is a cruel and spiteful thing to do.


Why? I thought that the whole point of the market system was that market forces will set the wage level. If people didn't pay tips then waitresses and waiters would (in capitalist theory) be unable to work in the current system and move to other industries. The restaurants would then have to pay more to encourage them back into the industry. In a system where tips are assumed, and in effect deducted from minimum payment to be given to the waitress/waiter, there is less pressure on the employer to pay the employers a good enough wage. In the long run a culture of mandatory tipping keeps the wages low.

Another key factor in capitalism is the idea that if you provide a good service, you get a better reward. Mandatory (either by law or cultural pressure) tipping goes against this - the waitress/waiter is getting the tip despite the service, not because of it. In an alternative system where they get tipped when the service is good, and not when it isn't, there is encouragement to offer a good service.

Originally posted by Jeroen Wenting:
Any place that has the tip included on the bill will get that amount deducted by me. I will decided whether to tip or not (and how much), I won't accept someone deciding that their service was good enough to charge me whichever percentage over the real price.
And he won't get any tip if he does that, even if he'd have gotten more than that amount had it not been "included".


I agree, this really takes the . In the UK (and it seems many other countries) tipping is based upon the quality of the service. When a restaurant adds a tip onto the bill without asking me, this stinks of arrogance on the restaurant's part. They are in effect saying "we don't think your opinion matters; we think we're good so pay us more money". When they do this after a less then brilliant service, this is even more annoying.

What they are attempting to do is to copy the American idea of a mandatory tip, which is especially annoying in places like the UK where the minimum wage is reasonable and doesn't rely on tips. They get away with it though, because a lot of people either don't notice the addition to the bill, or don't want the fuss of getting the bill reprinted.

Originally posted by Warren Dew:
I believe in zero based tipping. If there's no service - the table hasn't been cleared or cleaned when I sit down, no one ever shows up to take an order, no water or food is ever delivered - I don't tip. Anything above that merits a tip.


When I go to eat in a restaurant, I'd expect the restaurant to have clean and cleared tables. Unless the restaurant is self-service, I'd expect to have my food delivered. This is fairly standard for restaurants I believe. I don't see why I should pay extra money to receive the standard service. Food in restaurants is more expensive then food in super markets. The increase in price that customers pay goes towards the preparation of the food, the eating environment, and the service provided by the restaurant. The customer has already paid for the service once in the price of the meal, so it seems a bit strange to pay for it again in a tip. What'd I'd tip for is something above the expected service, so the tip is a reward for good, rather than expected, service. For example if the waitress/waiter was nice and friendly, remembered my funny order well, was responsive to any requests I had and served the food promptly, then I would tip well. If they merely gave the table a quick wipe, plonked my food on the table and forgot some of my order, then I would not tip as much, or at all.


There will be glitches in my transition from being a saloon bar sage to a world statesman. - Tony Banks
Roger Johnson
Ranch Hand

Joined: Feb 24, 2004
Posts: 311
$2 for ~$15 haircut.

why the hell they just keep growing.....
 
It is sorta covered in the JavaRanch Style Guide.
 
subject: paying tips at beauty salons or hair cutting salons