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Java Ranch Go game (meta-chat)

Layne Lund
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Joined: Dec 06, 2001
Posts: 3061
This is a new thread for meta chat regarding the Java Ranch Go Game. I thought this would be better than interupting the flow of the game in the main thread. I'm a relative noob to this game. I think 22. o18 should have been 22. L18 instead. Even if black tried 23. o18, white could respond with 24. P18 and be a lot better off. Is my thinking correct here? Of course, black would probably move somewhere else, and I'm not very good at figuring out what other options the opponent might consider. So if white moves 22.L18, what are some good options for black? Is it even possible to kill white from that point?

Layne

(edited my stuttering)
[ January 24, 2006: Message edited by: Layne Lund ]

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Roger Johnson
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Joined: Feb 24, 2004
Posts: 311
Originally posted by Layne Lund:
This is a new thread for meta chat regarding the Java Ranch Go Game. I thought this would be better than interupting the flow of the game in the main thread. I'm a relative noob to this game. I think 22. o18 should have been 22. L18 instead. Even if black tried 23. o18, white could respond with 24. P18 and be a lot better off. Is my thinking correct here? Of course, black would probably move somewhere else, and I'm not very good at figuring out what other options the opponent might consider. So if white moves 22.L18, what are some good options for black? Is it even possible to kill white from that point?

Layne

Layne



Nick George
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Joined: Apr 04, 2004
Posts: 815
that is much worse for white. Bo18 (probably) kills white's side, but at any rate puts him in trouble, while black secures the whole corner. Furthermore, white's center group then has no base, and can be attacked. I *think* white 18 at 20 would have been best, but the fact is that white was in big trouble after W14, because I could shut you in with B15. I think W14 had to be at 15.

[ January 24, 2006: Message edited by: Nick George ]
[ January 24, 2006: Message edited by: Nick George ]

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Layne Lund
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Joined: Dec 06, 2001
Posts: 3061
Thanks for the graphic, Roger. I can see now that it's not QUITE as good as I thought since white doesn't have a stone at N19.

Layne
Axel Janssen
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Joined: Jan 08, 2001
Posts: 2164
move 26 B:

I am going back to analyst postion.
Black has sente and its time to think well about the next move.
White player appears to be too dangerous a playerr for just throwing stones quickly on the board.
And: I have no board here and little time.

Q18


advantages:
- secures right upper corner for Black. I am not totally sure. Have to check this out on a board, if perhaps point 3/3 attack might work out for white attack (R17). This would be a showstopper for Q18.
- puts the white group in "immediate miai". Its like a ko-thread, right?

disadvantages:
- looses sente.

alternatives:
a) thiken left upper corner even more: C15 or F16.
b) attack in lower side and make whites building up of frameworks more difficult: f3
Nick George
Ranch Hand

Joined: Apr 04, 2004
Posts: 815
I'm afraid of Q18 because of the peep at R17 followed by the peep at R15. I was thinking if I wanted to secure the corner I'd go Q17, but that seems too small. I'm thinkning of considering P18 as a really really big gote move, and maybe approaching the bottom right at S6 and building up the right side.
Bert Bates
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Joined: Oct 14, 2002
Posts: 8815
    
    5
Ok, we have to remember that this is TEAM go so:

White player appears to be too dangerous a playerr for just throwing stones quickly on the board.


Is probably not a comment in the spirit of team go. In this case the sequence was played by at least two different players

A far p18, I suppose you could say that it's a big gote, but it's a REALLY big gote, like 20+ points!

Earlier. white could probably make a small life with the 3 captured stones by playing h18, but this group would be small and the black stones surrounding them would be HUGE compared to the few points white would get. It's very important for white to out in the center with the o16 and n13 stones, and for those stones to have a "base" as they do now. In my opinion, there is a really key point on the board now so that white can reduce the importance of the thick black group in the upper center. (I won't give away my idea for this key point).


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(If you're not on the edge, you're taking up too much room.)
 
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