wood burning stoves 2.0*
The moose likes Meaningless Drivel and the fly likes Portugal Vs Netherlands Big Moose Saloon
  Search | Java FAQ | Recent Topics | Flagged Topics | Hot Topics | Zero Replies
Register / Login
JavaRanch » Java Forums » Other » Meaningless Drivel
Bookmark "Portugal Vs Netherlands" Watch "Portugal Vs Netherlands" New topic
Author

Portugal Vs Netherlands

Zip Ped
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jul 26, 2005
Posts: 336
Anyone who had seen the game would agree with me that Portugal just tends to pick up fights in any knock out game. It happened in Euro cup 2004 and yesterday. 4 yellow cards and 2 red card in 10 mins of the game.

Man, I wanted to see all 22 players yellow carded, that would have really been fun to watch.
Paul Sturrock
Bartender

Joined: Apr 14, 2004
Posts: 10336

Dunno if Holland were completely blameless. Robben seemed to fall over if anyone came vaguely near him. And Van Bommell's reaction to Figo's "headbutt" was a bit over the top.

The ref spoiled the game. Too quick to reach for the card.


JavaRanch FAQ HowToAskQuestionsOnJavaRanch
Zip Ped
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jul 26, 2005
Posts: 336
Yeah, I think the referee probably lost his cool and just kept reaching onto his pockets for the yellow cards. Figo put up an Oscar winning act when he was nudged by one of the guys and the other guy got a red card for that. I think the game just touched a new level of insanity yesterday.
Zip Ped
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jul 26, 2005
Posts: 336
Check this out: http://www.time.com/time/europe/2006/wcup/062606,portugal.html
Chris Baron
Ranch Hand

Joined: Mar 21, 2003
Posts: 1049
The referee's mistake was not giving Boulahrouz the red card directly for his kung-fu attack against Cristiano Ronaldo. He injured his femoral on purpose. I can't interprete this stunt in another way. That's why aggressions cooked up.
cb
[ June 26, 2006: Message edited by: Chris Baron ]
Zip Ped
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jul 26, 2005
Posts: 336
I guess the game with England would be the one to watch for some more Football-wrestling action. They better be careful with 8 players carrying the yellow card.
Stefan Wagner
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jun 02, 2003
Posts: 1923

IMHO most cards were correct.
It seems bizzare to argue, an early red card would have done any better, since a lot of the cards were shown early.
When the players violate the rules, we shouldn't blame the referee for that.


http://home.arcor.de/hirnstrom/bewerbung
Paul Sturrock
Bartender

Joined: Apr 14, 2004
Posts: 10336

Hmm. Its true Deco should have gone for his first reckless and professional foul. But being sent off for holding the ball for a couple of seconds? That's daft. A free kick had been awarded anyway, so the referee had stopped the clock. There was no advantage to be had.
N Kriplani
Ranch Hand

Joined: Oct 10, 2005
Posts: 39
The ref. was a major problem. He shouldn't have started with the first yellow in the second minute on Van Bommel. Most refs would talk to a player once or twice before showing the yellow. No warnings from Ivanov. From then on it was mostly downhill. Figo should have been thrown out for headbutting, period. Head-butting or any kind of deliberate contact with the head is an automatic red card in the rules. But he got a yellow. They even reviewed it after the game but throwing out a "star" like Figo takes courage. Also, Figo has been known to do this in the past.

The Dutch played badly, but did anyone notice how much time was wasted in the second half by Portugal. On at least two or three occassions their goalkeeper Ricardo, wasted a lot of time. Stoppage time was six minutes, more like 10-12 at least. Portugal may be skilled but they are definitely no saints.

But the ref. was the one who decided the game. Probably the worst I have ever seen.

God save the queen. England are going to need to play out of their skin to beat Portugal. They played very badly. But I hope England win.
Stefan Wagner
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jun 02, 2003
Posts: 1923

Originally posted by Paul Sturrock:
But being sent off for holding the ball for a couple of seconds? That's daft. A free kick had been awarded anyway, so the referee had stopped the clock. There was no advantage to be had.


Originally posted by FIFA rules:

http://www.fifa.com/en/regulations/regulation/0,1584,3,00.html

A player is cautioned and shown the yellow card if he commits any of the following seven offences:

1. is guilty of unsporting behaviour
2. shows dissent by word or action
3. persistently infringes the Laws of the Game
4. delays the restart of play
5. fails to respect the required distance when play is restarted with a corner kick, free kick or throw-in
6. enters or re-enters the field of play without the referee�s permission
7. deliberately leaves the field of play without the referee�s permission.


If a player thinks, the price of a yellow card is too expensive for rule 4, he should avoid violating the rule.
If he doesn't respect the rule at all, he should keep away from football or send a petition to the FIFA to change the rules.

The referee is correct.
Paul Sturrock
Bartender

Joined: Apr 14, 2004
Posts: 10336

Aye, I know it is in the rules. My point is that the rule is a little heavy handed, and what is deemed a "delay" is up to interpretation by the ref. If play has stopped, so has the watch. Where is the advantage to the delaying team? I can see why refs might need this rule to card players who kill the game with long delaying tactics, but getting carded for holding on the the ball for a few seconds is overly pedantic in my opinion. Especially as it means one of the best players in the tournament now misses a match.
[ June 28, 2006: Message edited by: Paul Sturrock ]
Svend Rost
Ranch Hand

Joined: Oct 23, 2002
Posts: 904
N Kriplani :
Figo should have been thrown out for headbutting, period. Head-butting or any kind of deliberate contact with the head is an automatic red card in the rules.

To be honest, I dont know what was most pathetic. Figos "headbutt" or
Van Bommel's reaction.

2:40 and 3:01
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4Ixqw-0EXI&mode=related&search=figo%20holland

/Svend Rost
N Kriplani
Ranch Hand

Joined: Oct 10, 2005
Posts: 39
Van Bommel reacted to get Figo a red, cause he (belatedly) realized that head butting is a red. Theatrics for sure, cause the contact was definitely soft but that doesn't absolve Figo. It's sad that someone with so much skill on the ball lacks sportsmanship. Figo also got Bouhlarouz sent off, and that was not a deliberate elbow.

With this kind of refereeing though, the big matches could be decided by a ref. rather than some teamwork. And that's sad. Also, sucks to watch a game stop and start every two minutes and some player get sent off by an idiot who takes the rules too literally. It would be a shame if this happened.
Zip Ped
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jul 26, 2005
Posts: 336
I think the Kung Fu kick which Chris mentioned in an earlier post was probably the best(or worst) foul in that game. He would have probably beheaded the other player if he was on target.
Stefan Wagner
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jun 02, 2003
Posts: 1923

Originally posted by Paul Sturrock:
Where is the advantage to the delaying team? I can see why refs might need this rule to card players who kill the game with long delaying tactics, but getting carded for holding on the the ball for a few seconds is overly pedantic in my opinion. Especially as it means one of the best players in the tournament now misses a match.
[ June 28, 2006: Message edited by: Paul Sturrock ]


Would you like the rules to be different for 'best players in the tournament'?
Who decides who's one of the best players of the tournament?
If there is no advantage to the delaying team, why do they delay?

Advantages might be:
a) reorganizing the defense
b) get a small break
c) provoke the opponent

The FIFA claimed they will pedantically observe delays before the tournament started. Wouldn't it be annoying to claim special observation of this rule before the tournament, and then act contrary?

I don't like to see those small provocations all the time like delaying the game by holding the ball, or not keeping the prescribed distance.
A lot of these small rule violations have become normal behaviour and can be observed every few minutes.
I guess, only a pedantic punishment of such behaviour might stop it and players testing the limits should be shown where the limit is. It isn't 3 or 5 seconds, it's zero seconds.
A fast performed free kick keeps the game agile - isn't this that what you wanted?

And a single yellow card is a very harmless way to show the limit.
It has no effect, until a second yellow card is collected.

Fair play isn't taken seriously anymore in modern football for itself.
Instead a very calculating profits - costs habit reached place.
Therefore the costs must be increased, to keep the game somewhat fair.
Paul Sturrock
Bartender

Joined: Apr 14, 2004
Posts: 10336


Would you like the rules to be different for 'best players in the tournament'?
Who decides who's one of the best players of the tournament?

Ignore my comments about Deco's ability. I didn't intend this to be part of my argument, just an observation of the result of over-pedantic application of the rules. You've pointed out yourself that there is nothing specified in the rules beyond the phrase "delays the restart of play", and the delay remains open to interpretation. I like my sports officials to be in the background, stopping things getting out of hand, not in the foreground determining the outcome of games or competitions.


If there is no advantage to the delaying team, why do they delay

I've no idea. But I'm guessing most are heat of the moment reactions. There is less calculated thought in sport than many spectator attribute. What advantage do you think they gain? Give players the benefit of the doubt for the sake of the game.
Stefan Wagner
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jun 02, 2003
Posts: 1923

Originally posted by Paul Sturrock:

What advantage do you think they gain? Give players the benefit of the doubt for the sake of the game.


Advantages might be:
a) reorganizing the defense
b) get a small break
c) provoke the opponent

If the rules says every delay is penalized, we don't need officials in the background stopping time.

There is less calculated thought in sport than many spectator attribute.

I guess the opposite is right.
Unfair behaviour has become habit for a lot of players - that's true.
 
It is sorta covered in the JavaRanch Style Guide.
 
subject: Portugal Vs Netherlands