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The moose likes Cattle Drive and the fly likes Man, we need some new blood on the Drive! Big Moose Saloon
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Man, we need some new blood on the Drive!

Joe McGuire
Ranch Hand

Joined: Mar 19, 2001
Posts: 293
I just noticed that there were only 14 people listed on the Assignments Log. I don't think I've ever seen it so small!
Greg Harris
Ranch Hand

Joined: Apr 12, 2001
Posts: 1012
also, notice that there is only 1 person in elementary school...


what?
Johannes de Jong
tumbleweed
Bartender

Joined: Jan 27, 2001
Posts: 5089
Or the "old" blood must get their arses in gear and start submitting assignments again
Marilyn de Queiroz
Sheriff

Joined: Jul 22, 2000
Posts: 9053
    
  12
Since the new students are no longer *required* to post, it seems that most of them don't post here.


JavaBeginnersFaq
"Yesterday is history, tomorrow is a mystery, and today is a gift; that's why they call it the present." Eleanor Roosevelt
Lance Finney
Ranch Hand

Joined: Apr 26, 2001
Posts: 133
I assumed the lack of elementary students was mostly due to the addition of a $200 entry fee. Are there more out there?
Why aren't students required to post anymore? It didn't seem to be an onerous requirement.
Greg Harris
Ranch Hand

Joined: Apr 12, 2001
Posts: 1012
actually, i think posting to the cattle drive forum is half of the fun. i know i have been quiet for a while, but i am trying to get back into it.
JdJ... who might you be referring to in your post? not yourself, i hope!
Marilyn de Queiroz
Sheriff

Joined: Jul 22, 2000
Posts: 9053
    
  12
We don't have as many new students as we did for a while, but we do have a few. And most of them are not posting.

Perhaps we should consider re-implementing that requirement.
[ March 22, 2002: Message edited by: Marilyn deQueiroz ]
Johannes de Jong
tumbleweed
Bartender

Joined: Jan 27, 2001
Posts: 5089
Yep sure did Greg
By the way Marilyn. To get new blood how about offering 5 new students a free ride through the Cattle Drive.
I'l give it some thought this weekend as to how we could select these lucky 5
Pauline McNamara
Sheriff

Joined: Jan 19, 2001
Posts: 4012
    
    6
Being part of the forum is the fun part for me too, Greg.
I think without the posting requirement I probably would have remained shy about posting here, like the new Cattle Drivers.
Would two price schemes work? Like if you post you pay the lower price? Of course that introduces a policing requirement, yuck.
Anyway I like the idea of bringing in the posting requirement again, how ever it's implemented.
[ March 23, 2002: Message edited by: Pauline McNamara ]
jason adam
Chicken Farmer ()
Ranch Hand

Joined: May 08, 2001
Posts: 1932
Yeah, have a few people going through Elementary right now that haven't posted.
You used to have to post because Cattle Drive was free, and to continue to get the service you had to make regular posts.
Now that they charge, it's like any other service you pay for. If you want just that service, without any extra effort on your part, you get just the service.
I've mentioned it to a few of the Drivers I nitpick, they pretty much aren't the type to get in here and post.
Plus, seen an interesting drop off of people who actually did pay. They get a couple of assignments in, but then disappear for a bit. I'm thinking real life is impacting things a lot, but that's only an assumption.
Right now things are quite transitional anyways, so a low student level isn't a bad thing until other issues get ironed out or whatever. Still stinks to see a low active level.
Peter Gragert
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jan 16, 2001
Posts: 424
Though I appreciate the cattledrive very much, as a private person (not having a firm paying) I would not spent 200$ (+15 % in euro) to join the cattle drive ...
Maybe you make difference between 'professional' learners backupped by there company and other 'categories' of cowboys.
jason adam
Chicken Farmer ()
Ranch Hand

Joined: May 08, 2001
Posts: 1932
I wish my company had payed for it! Nope, this is all self-motivated.
Personally, I think every cent of the $200 was well worth it. Comparing myself to a year ago, we're talking leaps and bounds here.
$200 is basically 4-5 books, and that ain't saying they're good books, either. Now you get to read them on your own and not get any feedback.
$200 ain't even going to cover a single Java course at a University or a training class at some tech training school.
But again, I'm extremely biased
Sam Tilley
Ranch Hand

Joined: Dec 05, 2001
Posts: 160
I go along with Jason in that cattle ranch is easily worth the $200 with all the feedback. However i can see people getting disheartened and without an extra prod its easy to get to Say4-b or OOP-3 (my current bugbear) and just give up. I think paying is better as it means that it is worth something, if it had been free i might also have given up (although i hope not).
A couple points,
A bit more work would be involved and im not sure how easy it would be but would it be worth asking everyone who is doing it if they want to be put on the log, then if it is easy and the nitpickers can spare the time they could automatically update them on the log every time they complete an assignment and use the assignment log page more as a feedback page.

Also how about offering competitions on the cattle ranch like other threads to win a book drawn at random from those doing the drive or some other incentive, like those posting could get an extra assignment on say xml for free, etc etc.
Also is knowledge of the Javaranch very widespread??? i only found it by accident and am glad i did but i have never seen anything about the cattle ranch. Perhaps offer incentives for referrals and tie ins with other sites. I suppose one of the main things is what is the main purpose if Javaranch is it to promote java learning, for java cert, java discussion or cattle drive.
Otherwise i think its great, keep up the good work


Sam Tilley SCJP, SCWCD
Josue Cedeno
Ranch Hand

Joined: Feb 06, 2001
Posts: 71
Before programming I spent my days as a marketer (one level down from lawyer on the food chain). And from my experience I have learned that the only way to make the sale is to ask for the sale. There is a hefty list of "where have you beens." Send them an email. Put together a questionnarie with lots of cool bells and whistles. You may be surprised what the javaranchers will tell you if you just ask.
Hope my two cents helps. I think JR is a great service, and I look forward to each new nitpick as an opportunity to practice and get better.
Carol Murphy
village idiot
Bartender

Joined: Mar 15, 2001
Posts: 1199
I stumbled onto the Ranch after almost enrolling in a certain Computer school that went bankrupt. My funding fell through the day before I was going to enroll. Talk about dumb luck. ( Finding the Ranch, I mean! ) I think interest will pick up when the tech sector starts to bounce back. Right now people are still reeling from the downturn.
The Ranch is such a great thing, I can't even articulate my feelings. I think new students should be encouraged to post because it will add to their learning experience. I was hesitant at first because I didn't even know what questions to ask, and I was afraid of looking really STUPID. Then I decided looking stupid was preferential to not understanding this stuff. I have come to the conclusion that even a dumb observation can produce thought-provoking reponses from people who know how to do this coding thing very, very well.
Long live JavaRanch!
And if we can't get any fresh blood, the same old bloody drivers will have to do!
[ March 28, 2002: Message edited by: Carol Murphy ]
Night Cruz
Greenhorn

Joined: Jan 27, 2002
Posts: 15
Hi i would like to try the cattle drive. It would be great to get some feedbacks on the assignments you do but i think $200 is just too steep for me.
just a question can i still submit my assignments for free?
jason adam
Chicken Farmer ()
Ranch Hand

Joined: May 08, 2001
Posts: 1932
First, before you start anything you are going to want to change your name to conform to our naming policy. Go here to read the rules on how names should be presented.
Second, at this time the only way to get an individual nitpicking your code is to pay the $200. You can still go through the assignments on your own, and post questions in this forum on parts of the assignments you are having trouble with. Just don't post any code or detailed hints!
Night Cruz
Greenhorn

Joined: Jan 27, 2002
Posts: 15
1. whats wrong with my name? It what my parents gave to me. Unless you have a better name to give me.
2. thanks for the tip. I'll post if i'm having a problem in one of the questions
Jyotsna Clarkin
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jan 26, 2001
Posts: 158
Originally posted by jason adam:
[QB]
I'm thinking real life is impacting things a lot, but that's only an assumption.
[QB]

Too true in my case. In & out of short contracts this past year. And each new contract was harder to come by. The only skills "they" wanted were VB, VC++, ADO, ASP, SQL. This is what my new job needs plus I am to be trained in ASP/xml, .NET.
Would like to continue with the drive (I lost my nitpick as well - where is Bill???) Will get back to the drive in June when all this madness is over.
I think posting was an excellent requirement.
[ April 02, 2002: Message edited by: Jyotsna Clarkin ]
jason adam
Chicken Farmer ()
Ranch Hand

Joined: May 08, 2001
Posts: 1932
Originally posted by Night Cruz:
1. whats wrong with my name? It what my parents gave to me. Unless you have a better name to give me.

Nah, if that's your name, that's your name! It just "sounds" like Night Cruise, and as I am sure you can guess there are many people who visit here that try to do a funny little play on words with their registered name. Since that's one of the things bartenders watch for, we sometimes get it wrong. Hard to guess with all the different cultures visiting here what is real or not. My apologies.
Night Cruz
Greenhorn

Joined: Jan 27, 2002
Posts: 15
It's ok. no offense taken. I'm used to getting teased about it. Sigh!
 
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