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The moose likes Architect Certification (SCEA/OCMJEA) and the fly likes Oracle is greedy for money? Big Moose Saloon
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Oracle is greedy for money?

Jitendra Kumar Jain
Greenhorn

Joined: Jun 28, 2011
Posts: 17
By making instructor led training compulsory, i think Oracle is greedy for money..

I had a experience of 5 years and why should i take the courses again.. Is practical knowledge is not enough?

Very bad Oracle !!
Jari Timonen
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jan 16, 2004
Posts: 230
Agree totally. Or, if someone gives good reason to think otherwise?


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Amandeep Singh
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jul 17, 2008
Posts: 844
Indirectly they are increasing the value of the exam. or why not make it more tough exam? whichever the way, they found it make it precious by introducing mandatory course. Much same like Apple's pricey stuff marketing approach.


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Andrew Monkhouse
author and jackaroo
Marshal Commander

Joined: Mar 28, 2003
Posts: 11432
    
  85

I would disagree - given that (as far as I know), a person who gets certified tomorrow having taken the instructor lead training has exactly the same certification as someone who was certified six months ago. So they are not reducing their pool of certified architects at all.

I would also disagree with your comparison to Apple - they have not increased prices dramatically in this manner. I suspect you are thinking of Microsoft - if you purchase a computer with Microsoft Windows on it, and then ask for a refund for it, you might find that your refund for Windows 7 Home Premium is only $20 despite costing $95.99 for an upgrade (or $156 full price). This seems more like your analogy - start off at a really cheap price then once people are hooked, bump the price up 5 times for an upgrade, or 7.5 times for a full purchase.


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Amandeep Singh
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jul 17, 2008
Posts: 844
Andrew Monkhouse wrote:I would disagree - given that (as far as I know), a person who gets certified tomorrow having taken the instructor lead training has exactly the same certification as someone who was certified six months ago. So they are not reducing their pool of certified architects at all.


Reducing the pool is indirect impact of introducing mandatory course. I do not mean evicting existing architects from pool, I'm thinking future, the pace at which developers are getting certificates would definitely slow down. It can be thought in simple perspective, more the expensive product is more the chances it would be less in market.

I would also disagree with your comparison to Apple - they have not increased prices dramatically in this manner. I suspect you are thinking of Microsoft - if you purchase a computer with Microsoft Windows on it, and then ask for a refund for it, you might find that your refund for Windows 7 Home Premium is only $20 despite costing $95.99 for an upgrade (or $156 full price). This seems more like your analogy - start off at a really cheap price then once people are hooked, bump the price up 5 times for an upgrade, or 7.5 times for a full purchase.


I completely disagree with example, Microsoft upgrade example, it seems it's applied at wrong context opposite to what I'm talking/thinking/saying about. Nothing is about hooking up in SCEA certification. Think future, the developers getting certified at what cost. The developers who already got certified, they are well good, so they are out of context, & not impacted with introduction of mandatory course.
Prad Pat
Greenhorn

Joined: Nov 27, 2011
Posts: 1
Recently ex-student (now with Infosys, India as SPM) approached us for guidance for SCEA exam.We stopped Sun Certs coaching in 2010 due to falling standards in cert exams. Since this guy was one of our loyal students, we decided to guide him for all three levels. Surprise. Surprise. Now, to pass any oracle/Java/JEE exam, you need to attend one expensive training. Now, the question is candidates with 7-10+ years of experience in Java/JEE really need to attend the course in order to appear for the cert exam? Course is so expensive, no company will reimburse the course fee for sure. I think number of students appear for the exams will reduce by atleast 90-95% due to this new requirement. I am also of the view is Java/JEE will slowly lose importance in developing enterprise applications in future.
The day oracle acquired Sun, many of us ( myself, an ex-senior technical architect) went heart-broken. Lost interest in Java. In fact, recently I moved to Apple iOS platform and I am happy about that decision. In my opinion, Oracle took this decision just to shore up some revenue from cert exams and not for improving the quality of the cert exams. This controversial decision will surely backfire. That is for sure. Java is no more a choice language for open-source projects. In fact, PHP is gaining momentum and I am expecting some alternative new languages may prop up in future.
Tim Moores
Rancher

Joined: Sep 21, 2011
Posts: 2408
The link between the future of Java and the future of Java certifications is tenuous, to say the least. There are huge job markets where in my experience very little emphasis is put on these certifications (Europe and North America being prime examples), so -whatever the future of these certifications may be- I don't think they'll impact the usage of Java itself in a measurable way.
Cathal Mullan
Ranch Hand

Joined: May 20, 2011
Posts: 118
In my opinion this is a money grabbing move by Oracle.

Why would I waste thousands of pounds & 5 days of my life attending 1 of these courses when I can learn this stuff myself for free?

I was going to become a certified architect just to have it but not now.

In fact I have reduced the number of certifications I am going to take because I was going to take some just to prepare me for the architect exam.

Oracle is going to get less money out of me now!!!
Jeanne Boyarsky
internet detective
Marshal

Joined: May 26, 2003
Posts: 30370
    
150

I disagree that they are increasing the value of the exam. I blogged my thoughts on the topic. One of my points is that Spring Source (VM Ware) did this and the value of their exam went way down.


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Ranganathan Kaliyur Mannar
Bartender

Joined: Oct 16, 2003
Posts: 1076
    
  10

If they wanted to increase the value of the exam, they could have simply made the scjp certification compulsory...(and that would increase the revenue too)...
introduction of the course is a painful move for several reasons...apart from the money, people in jobs have to spend 5 full days out of their work to take the course...


Ranga.
SCJP 1.4, OCMJEA/SCEA 5.0.
Cathal Mullan
Ranch Hand

Joined: May 20, 2011
Posts: 118
Some people like myself do not live in a city where the courses are held.

I would have to pay for travel, 5 days accomodation & food on top of the cost of taking the course & exams!!!

That would make the total cost close to £5,000; what a disaster!!!
Jari Timonen
Ranch Hand

Joined: Jan 16, 2004
Posts: 230
Jeanne Boyarsky wrote:I disagree that they are increasing the value of the exam. I blogged my thoughts on the topic. One of my points is that Spring Source (VM Ware) did this and the value of their exam went way down.


+1
Jitendra Kumar Jain
Greenhorn

Joined: Jun 28, 2011
Posts: 17
Thanks Guys for your valuable inputs.

I have concluded two points after reading all the posts.

1)Either Oracle doesn't believe its own examination. I mean they are not confident on its own paper sets. That's why they want everyone to go through these classes. They think even a dumb guy with a preparation can pass this examination.

2)If they really want to make a class based preparation, then it can be a nominal amount. $5000 is very huge amount. (They have to know that even many big entrepreneurs never attended proper classes )
 
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