Java or NOT Java?

[Ji Wang]

Some questions concerning my next move.
Having been writing programs with Fortran for numerical analysis for over ten years. Jumped to a dotcom and served management positions for one and half years. Now the startup is belly up and jobs I have experiences are difficult to come (only in some specialized companies and national labs). Also my change of industry will turn some old companies off.
Now I need to polish my programming skills for something to do in next few months or so. I cannot idle for too long.
However, I have to decide what to learn and where to go.
Telecom is quite bad.
Dotcoms are dead.
Java is also not popular to many of us.
Any suggestion for my particular situation? Continue polish Java with J2EE, EJB, Servlets, or trying something else? Will Java be still needed after six months or so?

[steb]

Of course NOT Java. Anything but it.
Java is dead product. Just look what have happened with it
over the last 5 years or so:
1) Java was invented as a language and OS to program embedded systems. This didn't work. The majority of embedded systems are still being programmed in C, C++, and yes Basic.
2) Then Sun tried to reposition Java as a tool for writing desktop applications. This didn't work either. It was too slow for desktop users who are accustomed to much faster GUI apps like Word or Excel.
3) Java was tried as a language for middleware: J2EE and such. It have had some considerable success there. Unfortunately Microsoft is coming full speed with a better suit of middleware products: dotNET, C# (which is "better" Java), next SQL Server etc. Sun's going to have hard time competing against M$.
4) With J2ME, Java now comes full circle back to the embeded systems market were it was born. Well, it's going to failure again, as native code C apps always beat crap out of slow interpretive bytecode ones.
(Note how I omitted the Web. Considering the continuing dotcom fallout, and quickly squeezing market for Web tools, I don't think there will be any place left for JSP jockeys. With perl, ColdFusion, or ASP you can get a site up and running much faster.)
So, taking into account that you have alot of number crunching experience, I would advise to pursue that field.

[This message has been edited by steb (edited July 25, 2001).]

[john towns]

steb, I think I have to agree with some of your points. But there are a lot of advantages using Java over C. (java offers an excellent tools of API, where C doesn't have any standard web API)..Moreover, many people will back-off from using C/C++(complex!) and C# (M$ bugs!!). I don't know how C# will perform in the programming market!
Anyway, I'll stick with Java foreover, cause its simple, high-performance and excellent API, and I'm lazy in learning millions! of languages constantly.

[Cameron Park]

I don't know how many software vendors will make their products comply to MS specifications in regards to .Net. Think Oracle, Sun, IBM, Borland?
Also even ASP needs to use servlets when accessing COM objects on another platforms, and we know most servers are not on NT or w2k.
I have met quite a number of programmers (C, asm) who are now out of jobs. This is not confined to Java only. Java's future is now of course challenged by MS, but fortunately, MS is playing one of its rare underdog this time.

[krishna anand]

Dear Friends
Java is getting more popular and stronger on the server side and this is the area in which there are likely to be more jobs in the future and so if anyone is interested in going the Java line they should focus on J2EE Technologies .
------------------
Krishna

[Alok Pota]

steb's reponse:-
(Note how I omitted the Web. Considering the continuing dotcom fallout, and quickly squeezing market for Web tools, I don't think there will be any place left for JSP jockeys. With perl, ColdFusion, or ASP you can get a site up and running much faster.)
yup, perhaps thats why M$ has positioned C# to be a web ready language with integrated supported for *WEB* services. Perhaps thats why M$ is coming out with *WEB* friendly standards like SOAP and so heavily incorporating XML in their strategy because they feel standalone applications running at a 7-11 are "cutting edge" :-). The *web* is dead. Since when?
Just because .coms are dead does not mean the web is dead. The Web in fact is getting to be more important than ever. M$ is incorporating their *WEB* tool IE in all their office applications.
The web is here to stay and so is every web ready language such as Java, C#, perl, ASP. Coldfusion..
Oh yeah BTW E-bay, Wal-Mart, Amazon they all run on ColdFusion
:-)
I feel like laughing...

[Bartholemu Smith]

Ebay and Amazon don't run on ColFusion...None of the webpages have a cfm extension...
I might be wrong, but I think you can tell a ColdFusion site from the Page extensions
Faisal

[Alok Pota]

I was being sarcastic :-)

[john towns]

ColdFusions pages doesn't need .cfm extensions.. ColdFusion offers some excellent tool for deploying advanced sites in not-time (much faster than J2EE, with scalability issues included)..
but I'm still sticking with J2EE..
You can do alomost do everything with Coldfusion (related techinlogies) that you can do with J2EE. And, Java developers are much more expensive to hire than other developers!!
just my 2cs...

[Ilja Preuss]

Originally posted by john towns:
Java developers are much more expensive to hire than other developers!!

Well, maybe it's because they are much more productive than other developers...?
[This message has been edited by Ilja Preuss (edited July 29, 2001).]
[This message has been edited by Ilja Preuss (edited July 29, 2001).]

[Raghav Mathur]

ok ....... if you think that java is dead and is no more popular . AS you said you've been programming with fortran which is good .
IF you want to upgrade or polish your programming skills , let me tell you that java is an excellent tool for your purpose.
No matter if its useless for you , still it will prove to be benefitial for you .