buying non mid east gas

[paul wheaton]

(I'm not sure how accurate this is, but it does sound interesting. This was forwarded to me by a friend.)

GASOLINE SOLUTION! We CAN buy gasoline that's not from Middle East.
The Saudis are boycotting American goods. We should return the favor. An
interesting thought is to boycott their GAS. Every time you fill up
the car, you can avoid putting more money into the coffers of Saudi Arabia.
Just buy from gas companies that don't import their oil from the Saudis.
Nothing is more frustrating than the feeling that every time I
fill-up the tank, I am sending my money to people who are trying to kill me, my
family, and my friends. I thought it might be interesting for you to know
which oil companies are the best to buy gas from and which major companies
import Middle Eastern oil (for the period 9/1/00 - 8/31/01):
Shell.........................205,742,000 barrels
Chevron/Texaco................144,332,000 barrels
Exxon /Mobil..................130,082,000 barrels
Marathon/Speedway.............117,740,000 barrels
Amoco..........................62,231,000 barrels
If you do the math at $30/barrel, these imports amount to over $18 BILLION!
Here are some large companies that do not import Middle Eastern oil:
Citgo................................0 barrels
Sunoco...............................0 barrels
Conoco...............................0 barrels
Sinclair.............................0 barrels
BP/Phillips..........................0 barrels
Hess.................................0
All of this information is available from the Department of Energy
and each is required to state where they get their oil and how much they are
importing.They report on a monthly basis. Keep this list in your car;
share it with friends. Stop paying for terrorism.............

[paul wheaton]

Further info ...
http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/oilterrorism.htm

[paul wheaton]

Here is some interesting info too. On the bottom left side of the page is a little chart showing who's good to buy from and who isn't. If you read the fine print, it sounds like the bar graphs can be misleading because a company might not buy a lot of oil from the mid east, but they will buy from another company that bought it from the mid east.
http://www.boycott-middle-east-oil.com/
[ February 22, 2003: Message edited by: Paul Wheaton ]

[omar khan]

Originally posted by Paul Wheaton:
[QB]Here is some interesting info too. [/URL]
The posted stats do not seem to be very accurate.
Look here:
Imports from Persian Gulf
E.g. Citgo may not import from Saudi Arabia, but it does import from other "Axis of Evil" nations
If one really wants to boycott "the Axis of Evil" he/she should ride a bicycle.
This will also improve health + environment.

[ February 24, 2003: Message edited by: OMAR KHAN ]

[Michael Ernest]

All right, Rufus, pay freaking attention. This is a liberal argument: "everyone should ride a bicycle if they want to boycott the Axis of Evil." The beauty of it is it's exactly conservative logic, e.g.: "everyone should get the hell out of America if they don't like it." All you have to do is change the verbs and nouns.
So on this piece of plain ground I post my bitch about liberal and conservative categorizations of speech. I think it's the rhetorical equivalent of two lines of monkeys throwing their feces at each other. Amusing for a while, then just messy, then finally tiresome in its repetition.
My idea of so-called liberal and conservative arguements is essentially that: points simplified so grossly that no one can agree with them except by way of sensing a shared sentiment about how things are or should be.
I hijack this topic in the name of two things: I'm tired of hearing 'liberal' being used as some sort of damning label; and two, I'm tired of the kinds of statements that just beg for them to be used.

[omar khan]

Originally posted by Michael Ernest:
This is a liberal argument: "everyone should ride a bicycle if they want to boycott the Axis of Evil." The beauty of it is it's exactly conservative logic, e.g.: "everyone should get the hell out of America if they don't like it." All you have to do is change the verbs and nouns.
[/QB]

If you change verbs and nouns you can get everything out of everything.
Sentence (1): I ate a cake.
-->change verbs and nouns -->
Sentence (1): I climbed a mountain.
I do not get your point.

[Michael Ernest]

That's ok too.

[R K Singh]

Originally posted by Paul Wheaton:

http://www.boycott-middle-east-oil.com/

This site is one of thsoe sites whose only job is to spread hatred among everyone.
Reason I am saying is this, is Find out about Christian Persecution in Saudi Arabia. this quote on the site and all other "News Header" on the page.
AW Keep it up.
[ February 24, 2003: Message edited by: Ravish Kumar ]

[paul wheaton]

I like the bicycle idea. I went years as an adult without a car - I just used my bike!
When I finally did get a car, I tried to keep it parked at least five days of the week.
While I think there is some truth to the hatred thing, I don't think it is absolutely true. Granted, these guys are a little militia-like, but the info provided is interesting. I think this is an example of picking out the information you want and ignoring the rest.
I think the point about America's gasoline purchases funding terrorism against America is pretty sound. It would seem that people that want to avoid war would want to follow the purchasing advice proposed on this page. It would also seem that people that want to crush trrorists would be into this too.

[Thomas Paul]

Originally posted by OMAR KHAN:
E.g. Citgo may not import from Saudi Arabia, but it does import from other "Axis of Evil" nations

But not all Persina Gulf countries are in the axis of evil! Certainly Qatar is a good friend to the USA.

[Thomas Paul]

Originally posted by Ravish Kumar:

This site is one of thsoe sites whose only job is to spread hatred among everyone.
Reason I am saying is this, is Find out about Christian Persecution in Saudi Arabia. this quote on the site and all other "News Header" on the page.

Are you saying that Christians are not persecuted in Saudi Arabia?

[Tim Holloway]

Originally posted by Paul Wheaton:
...
I think this is an example of picking out the information you want and ignoring the rest.

Hmmmm. I though that was a pretty good description of the scientific underpinnings of both the liberal and conservative points of view.
What I do have to protest is the foolishness of the idea that you can somehow "crush" terrorism by the simple use of overwhelming force.
Iraq you can crush. North Korea you can crush. But groups of individuals you can only "crush", if you can permanently imprison or exterminate each and every participant. Israel and Palestine have been rather busy giving graphic demonstrations of the counterproductiveness of physical force. As have the factions in Northern Ireland and the Hatfields and the McCoys.
Force is very satisfying to apply, but force begets force. The only way to get peace short of genocide appears to be to to forgo the satifaction of the payback and to attempt to learn to live together. And to refuse to be incited by those who will attempt to re-ignite the issue. Which is actually a lot harder and a lot less satisfying than rolling in tanks and helicopters.
But this is a highly-leveraged world we live in. One person, using commonly-available and relatively inexpensive resources can wreak horrendous damage, as we have seen. We don't even need major political, economic or religious issues to suffer the effects of these madmen. There's always going to be somebody.
On the other hand, while it's impossible to find and stop every nutcase capable of wreaking havoc, we can certainly look to ways to reduce the misery that can cause people to become -- or to follow -- people whose minds are filled with hatred and destruction.
This doesn't mean that we'll get anywhere by being all idiotic and apologetic liberal-style. Unearned gains are galling and willful blindness to evil is contemptible. But the liberal virtues of generousity and understanding would help (just as long as it's not the "generosity" of giving what resides in someone else's pockets!).
Likewise there are conservative virtues we should cultivate. When people feel their fortune has been honestly earned, they'll respect it and the world the more. When people feel that when they invest their time and resources and stand a reasonable change of having it pay off - of seeing both the consequences of wisdom and of folly each earn their proper rewards - then they can contemplate a world where desperate meaasure aren't the only solution. At the same time, the conservative vices of blind selfishness and seeing every other person's prosperity as a diminution of one's one prosperity - and in extreme cases something to be stolen or extorted - have to be suppressed.
But I've said it before. Ideology is for idiots. Ideology is ultimately based on false logic - the attempt to extend situation B to the rules that worked for situation A, just because in a simple and aesthetically pleasing universe they "ought" to.
In other words, peace, like everything else worthwhile, is hard work. The Hatfields and McCoys still don't like each other, and there's little enough love between Egypt and Israel. But it can be done. And in a highly-leveraged world, we really don't have the luxury of not doing it any more.

[Rufus BugleWeed]

All right, Rufus, pay freaking attention.

Sorry for not getting back to you sooner, I got snowed in.
Are you feeling OK?
Maybe JChong could spot you a zoloft.
P.S. Anybody here old enough to remember the OPEC embargo?
P.S.S. When you buy a a gallon of oil, whatever fraction of oil the MidEast pumped that day, you might as well consider your gallon that percent mideast oil. Economists have a name for this concept.
Ride your bike.
Add insulation.
Grow your own.
Stay home and surf.
Keep your tires inflated.
Build a fusion reactor in your spare time in your garage. You'll make tons more money than the guys who fixed modems or the guys who built oscilliscopes...

[R K Singh]

Originally posted by Thomas Paul:
Are you saying that Christians are not persecuted in Saudi Arabia?

You are right. There might be persecution of Christians in all over the world.
I am saying if a site contains only *such news* then this site is for spreading hatred among christians and muslims.
Google the net, you will find 1000s of site which will have news of persecution of Muslims in non-muslim countries. Such sites aim is what is this site's aim is.
But if one thinks that this site is doing a *good job*, I am in *no mood* to argue that *NO* it is *not doing* good job.
Please be happy that this site is doing good for all.

[Cindy Glass]

Gee, Paul, you made me go ahead and switch gas stations :roll: .
Found that I needed to try out the new Citgo along the way to work .
Course I had to pay 2 cents more per gallon - lets see, that cost me 20 cents.
Gee, Paul, you expect a lot out of us poor unpolitical folks :roll: